Please, tell me this is not the same scene. (at least tell me it's not the same fish!). And if it is the same scene with the same fish, please tell me it is a problem with your camera, and in real life it looks like the lower pic.

Jones,

The difference in color is probably because of the color temp of the Eye bulb. A Whiter bulb would help make the picture less yellow. I think it lok spretty good. Also, what are you comparing it to? Where did you get the bottom picture?

If this is true this lamp sucks!!!


How much does it cost and where can I get it ?.


I don't. The color has only one dimension in the upper pic. It's horrible. Of course if you compare it to nothing then I guess it's passable.



That's not the point, the LCD panel should reproduce the colors faithfully. I never knew a lamp can have such devastating outcome... We might not be able to improve the CR with current technology, but we SHOULD improve these colors!!!



Edit:
Ok, let's try to remain productive here. It seems like Brainchild's pj is totally not calibrated in terms of color. If he will try to calibrate it, I believe he might be able to improve things drastically in terms of color accuracy. The problem is, he will need to attenuate the dominating colors (I think red), which will translate into reduced contrast ratio. I'm starting to understand the notion behind those who say that the color temp of the lamp should match that of the original backlight.

Jones, First, please don't attack my results in my projector thread.

The lamp doesn't suck, the lamp is great. Where did you get the screenshot to which you are comparing? Because the movie didn't have that coloration on my CRT monitor. It looks way too saturated. I could get my projector to look like probably but it would look very unnatural in fleshtones.

Look at the color of the fish on Pixar's website:

http://www.pixar.com/featurefilms/nemo/

Again the fish is orange, not red.

http://mysite.freeserve.com/spwalls/nemo/f...and_dory_2s.jpg

Jones, buddy, pal... Did it ever occur to you that the problem might be with the other projector?

I find myself defending you in the forums, chat room, and yes, sometimes even in my own mind. You are a critic. Many people dislike critics. I don't. If everyone were immediately satisfied with what they had we'd all be driving Model Ts and flying Wright flyers. It is because of the critics of the world that we have moved up to driving Vipers and flying F-22 Raptors.

But what bothers me about your criticisms is that you seem to be constantly biased against the lumenlab projector. You have a habit of taking random screen shots sourced from goodness knows where and comparing them to lumenlab screen shots. You did it with joewerb's 5th element shots, ad now with brainchild's Nemo shots. Both times you naturally assumed that the lumenlab projector was flawed and that GOD himself must have built the other pj.

We live in a world where it is not difficult or even uncommon to doctor photos. I've seen 'double exposure' pics touted as 'actual screen shots' (screen Goo), I've seen 10 second exposure times, and even obvious 'cut and paste' jobs all claiming the same. Yet you seem determined to 'prove' that the lumenlab pj isn't worth a dime. What gives, man?!

I am fairly good at reading people, but I don't understand you, and that bothers me...

What gives Jones?

You have some person problems in yor life that you can not ecept good work?

I yet to see you built or even attept to build anything what so ever so i do not think you have the 1st hand experiance to judge anything in the projector world.

Look man i built mine for less than 350.00, no way in hell you could even get close to my images with a commercial projector that cost the same amount, it just simply does not exist.

Sorry man but i would rather you just keep your opinions to yourself if you do not have anything nice to say...

Oh, BTW, nemo and his father is orange not redish color so the pic you have is not a true color pic. If i adject mine i can get it to turn red....


Laterz.

I guess it is a little too late to say:

"the bottom pic is nice and vivid, but the color is all to H***."

Personally, I don't think it looks nice at all. I think it looks like crap, and brain's results looks like twice the image! Bad pic to compare to, JR...

You know, the more I think about it, the more I have come to believe that Grayson and Kellie decided the forums were a little dull, and decided to add a fictional character to our little group of friends, whom we have all come to know and love, as Jones Rush.

That's right. I believe Jr is not real. I mean, how could anyone be so stupid in real life? How could anyone still be alive, if in the real world, they addressed everyone they met the way Jr does in these forums? I mean he'd have gotten his arse kicked so many times, he'd be dead, right?

Very funny Brain and Lustra, very funny. You've had us all going for a while now. We'd like you to stop though. Jr is REALLY getting on our nerves.

Hey, is it possible to put a sound file on our posts? I want to show a picture of a rotating police light, with a siren sound too.

Everytime Jr makes a post, I want to follow it with this pic/sound, followed by the caption: "IDIOT ALERT!!!"

Jones,

the percula clown fish is in fact orange. I know, I am a bit of a salt water Enthusiast. Brains, pic is very close to the way pixar inteneded the fish to look.

Sorry man.

Cheers,
Lee

Well, I knew I should have avoided cartoons at all costs...

It seems like you're right and I'm wrong. (it also seems like some people in this thread were looking forward with vengeance to this day , eh tony ? ).

Anyway, about me bringing unrelated pics to put down the project's pj, let's examine the facts. In one thread I posted many pics of the same scene in the fifth element, and the lumenlab looked better than some of the pics there. I also posted two pics when I wanted to make a point that if the pictures look near perfect, than it must mean the pj is doing something right (and I posted two, near perfect pics, to show what I meant by "near perfect".). And, I posted this pic.

About this pic, if you think it's so important, then ok, it was taken by the Immersive Virtuoso HT720 pj. Now, if it was a lower end pj (like the Z2 or AE500), I would have been more careful before saying something about it, but I think most people who didn't see Finding Nemo (or don't remember exactly which color was each animal), would have come to the same conclusion that I did, after seeing both pics, considering the fact that the pic with Brainchild's pj looks totally drained out of colors, in comparison (Brainchild pj doesn't even show small traces of the colors in that other pic, none!, that's astonishing, where did that other pj get all these beautiful colors from ?, look especially at the turbulence below the fishes, that's almost too much of a difference. if you look real closely these colors don't seem to be on brainchild's pic palette at all. Might have been lost by the camera).

Anyway, I didn't "attack" Brainchild's projector, I just wanted to know why his pic doesn't look like the pic I thought was more genuine (apparently I was wrong. So what ?, here I am, less than 24 hours after it, admitting my "horrible" mistake. did this mistake cost american lives ?). After mccamp82 reply, I was simply going along with his assumption that it is indeed the lamp.

Jones,

To make you happy, I will in fact fire this bad boy up on my "high end" Sony WEGA Trinitron flat screen TV at home. Then take a comparison of color, detail and contrast.

Camera pictures will not do the picture justice, but I will take a few shots.

Cheers,
Lee

Thanks Norlander, looking forward for you results.

Ok Jones what i said here apllys here also....

http://www.lumenlab.com/forums/index.php?s...opic=52&st=320&

Laterz........

Ok, here we go!

Setup:

Pic is finding nemo as rendered on a Sony WEGA Trinitron TV input source is non-pscan dvd over S-Video.

Camera is a HP 910 2.4MP with pentax lens set to auto.

Environment is a Dark room with some ambient light from outside.

THIS IS NOT A FRONT PROJECTED IMAGE... So don't ask

I think the results of our projectors are awesome... Just look at this pic from my high end TV.

If you want to compare photos please scroll up and look at Jones post. I don't want to add those photos to this post.

Need to save bandwidth!

That's great news Norlander!.
Can you also take the exact same pic Brainchild took (with the dead/sleeping fish) ?.

I ran home on my lunch and snaped that shot then came back to work. I will snap another when I get home tonight.

Cheers,
Lee

Wow.

I'm with OKflyboy in that everything needs to be criticized. However before you can criticize/compare the first thing you should do is at least watch the friggin movie you are giving opinions on.

I have noticed several different pics from everyone's projector of the same scene but until I watch the movie I can't really pipe in with my comments/compare it with other pics because I don't know what it's supposed to look like in the first place so how would I know which one is the correct one...unless you comparing clarity.

Either way thought I'd reply with a non-flaming post to tone it down a little Although I'm not a fan of the topic title that was select

I want to start by saying something in Jones' defence - he can give a lot of criticism, but he can take it too.

But to add to what OKflyboy said, what are you Jones? You can't be a disgruntled customer, who has made the lumenlab pj and are not happy with it, you can't be someone who comes onto these boards just to knock down what we have built up for a hobby, and you can't be a rival of brainchild's from another site...or can you?

Whatever you are, you can't just be a troll, you are too calm and precise. I'm sure you are enjoying the specualtion...hmm...

I won't mind being one, just show me a site with a better alternative.


I guess you might be able to narrow down the speculations a bit, once Brainchild will ask for the Zoom lens money.


Btw, Norlander, you think you'll have time today to post that dead/sleeping fish pic ?.

I think you should just build one and see, I'm sure yours will be excellent btw. If you can't get satisfactory results however, then you'll have no problems selling your parts I'm sure. It's not a high-risk investment in that sense. I know it's time that's an issue for you

With your criticisms, are you trying to justify the lumenlab pj's worth to yourself, or just playing devil's advocate for everyone else's sake?

I would like to see it also but then again it is going to be as Orange as BC's projector image...but just for shitzs and giggles I'd like to see it

Again how can you compare results of a projector if you haven't even watched the movie?

Yes I have watched it several times, I have a 2yr old son, and yes the fish is sleeping! Again if you haven't watched it on at least your average TV, since you haven't built the projector, you can't compare screen shots because you have no idea what the colors are supposed to look like.

However if you buy one of those $7,000+ projectors you listed in your previous posts JR you could post the results and make our pics look inferior...then again we could laugh because ours cost at max $700 and the others cost 10x that

Jones Rush,
I believe those two shots may be from the same scene but they are different from the camera point of view when they shot/processed the movie through the computer system. I watched Nemo again this past weekend on an IBM Thinkpad A30 laptop with a good ATI Radeon video board in it and notice the two color differences, maybe within seconds of each other. If you look carefully at those paused pictures, you'll notice that they're not exactly the same - a good test would be to play a 1 minute segment of that same footage with some kind of index indicator so you can tell exactly where you get the different colors and at what points.
What I'm trying to say in a nutshell, is that the coloration is imbedded in the original movie and not a direct function of the player used, not the color temp of the Eye bulb in our PJ, not the PJ itself. Does this make sense to anyone?
Watch that section of the movie again before answering to this and you'll fully understand waht I'm saying here.
Thanks.

ScOrPiOn, the pic Norlaner took is from a direct CRT tv. If the pic he took didn't look similar to what he saw on the screen, color wise, he would have said so. This pic proves the lumenlab pj is the more accurate. I just want to see the exact pic Brainchild took. No, this comparison isn't ideal, but it does have its merits.


Neither, my criticism is for productive reasons only. Again, until september we still have 4 more months, and this project is still not flaw-free. At the middle of october I'm back for a new semester, so I'll hardly have time (or money) to tweak the fundamental construction, after it is built and the parts are bought.

Two months ago, in one of my first posts in the forum someone asked me:


My reply was:


... 60 days later, and all these goals have been achieved, thanks to Brainchild and others. So what now ?, instead of resting on laurels, I want to discover as much flaws as I can, AND see or learn ways to get them fixed in the remaining time period. Of course not every flaw can be fixed, but that's a given.

Everyday I didn't discover a flaw, is a bad day. Everyday I know of a flaw which hasn't been fixed, is a bad day. How is that for a recipe for constant bad days ?.

I'd be interested in what the next flaw you uncover is. You will probably find them before we do.

I just think you should tone down the severity of your attacks. Lumenlab is not an empire yet, we are still the underdogs

Hi Guys,

Jones, I agree, you should tone down the severity of your attacks. As for the scene in Finding Nemo, I will try and post that this afternoon.

Jones, in closing I must say that I believe your input to be very valuable to the community. However, we know that our projects are not perfect. Please refrain from stating the obvious, and try to offer a solution for any problems you might find.

Cheers,
Lee

But what is the obvious ?. can you give me a list of "obvious" picture quality flaws of the lumenlab pj ?. For two months I'm trying to figure out the "obvious" flaws, but have hard time doing that, since you guys are holding the cards very close to your chest.

I think the obvious in this case would be the fact that we know our pjs aren't perfect, after all it is touted as a 'simple' projector, not a 'perfect' one. It has bags of upgradablity. I just think you should reserve your harsher comments, you seem to 'argue' your point, when if you just queried and speculated like the rest of us, you wouldn't be so often misconstrued as the lumenlab party pooper

Brain and the guys are working towards perfection, just at a slower rate than you would like. However the pj that would satisfy you would be superfluous to a lot of people's needs. (Still, I'd really like to see it..)

jeeze i would hate to here what you guys thought about my pj - man whats up - this is a DIY - OBTW i got my benq over the weekend - still need four pieces of glass and a reflector - well anyway -

Here is the pic to compare to brains.

Camera: HP 910 Pentax lens setting is auto.

Lighting: Moderately dark room.

Image: Un-touched picture from my Sony Trinitron WEGA TV.

Color: Slightly more pink in the real image on the anemone under the sleeping Nemo's dad.

Keep in mind this picture is from a high end CRT television. Not a front projection.

Note: The difference in color could be more the camera then the actual picture. Brains projector is still very, very close to the original movie.

Brains projector ROCKS.

Cheers,
Nor

and Brainchilds:

Looks like I need to turn up the blue a bit. Also I never zeroed my cam's white balance (keep forgetting). Now that I know how it should look I could try again..?

Thanks Norlander!

Brain, It would be great to see that same scene again from your tweaked pj/camera to compare.

I second that motion.

Brainchild, Please, tell me this is not the same scene. (at least tell me it's not the same fish!). And if it is the same scene with the same fish, please tell me it is a problem with your camera, and in real life it looks like the pic below!

Hi Brain,

Your pic is really not that far off! Keep in mind I said my picture was lacking some pink... In person the color is a bit more popping, I am going to guess your true pic is also more "popping" in person.

Take a look at the orange on the fish. Both pictures are close in color.

If you look at the purple\pink, you will see that yours is lighter in color then mine. Think of my picture with a bit of a pink hue over the purple and you have the exact rendering on my TV...

So your picture is a bit light on the pink side... Keep in mind that even in the CRT world the picture will very between TV manufacturers.

As an after thought, look at the detail. You can see the bubbles in both pictures...

That is awsome!
Lee

LOL @ Tony

BUBBLES! Bubbles bubbles bubbles.... MY bubbles!"

No Jr, I'm sorry, you're not going to get that one. You're much too mature to watch an animated feature film, err, I mean cartoon.

Jones, as you are interested in flesh-tones, here is the exact same scene as redered in my aquarium. Sorry it's not identical, but I couldn't get them to pose for long..

PLEASE tell me your camera is messed up! I saw this movie once, and the sea anemane (sp?) were pink, no where near the green you are showing!

Tony, lol.

Yeah, yeah, joke all you want. My treat.

Thank you for taking it.

This is not a jab. I just found some fantastic results, someone who knows how to take excellent pictures too. Look him up in the projector results.

He's using his own webspace, bandwidth not going to waste here.





These were without a screen, except Gandalf, I think.

Wow. This guy is a professional!. I went through his work and the great looking pics didn't happen by a chance. it seems like he knew exactly what he was doing every step of the way.

The picture I like most is of Gandalf. I really hated the way Brainchild's pic looked, all washed out:

You take it so well though Jones. We forget you're human sometimes

If Jones had feelings, I'd be worried about hurting them. That was a soft jab.

Of course he couldn't just let it be with a positive comment, had to call someone else's pics washed out, didn't he? LOL. I love you man!