I found this while looking for an alternative to the N6. Think this could work? It has VGA out, but i wonder if it is only in HD resolutions like 1280x720...

http://www.ptusainc.com/ProductInfo.aspx?p...TR-9955&affid=6

Wow. That does look promising - I may have to check it out.

After looking at its specs and knowing what it can do, this product seems almost too good to be true!

HERE is the spec sheet.

Stuff like this is usually very expensive, and I thought maybe the link mentioned above had a mistake on their price. I did a quick search of other online stores selling this. Sure enough, many are selling it for $700. But then again others are selling it between $140 and $200. I don't know what to think.

It also has more picture adjustment options than the standard cheap video processor. One that caught my eye is a unique contrast enhancement seperate from the standard contrast adjustment. Could it possibly be a sort of gamma control?

O.O nice find and for only around $150 w/shipping! I have been looking for a good video processor for a while, if I had more money I'd prob pick this one up. If you look on the spec sheet it shows a picture of all the connectors on the back, theirs a bunch of them. Oh yeah I found one for 136$ on eBay http://cgi.ebay.com/899-Philips-FTR9955-17...1QQcmdZViewItem

Just curious i have been in the electronics business and field for a long time. Is this an upscaler? I am confused never really saw a box like this. Goes between connection and PJ correct. Looks really nice. The price is good too.

Yeah, I stumbled opon it last night, thought it was a sweeeet find, i mean, look at the specs, good god! That smokes the hell out of an N6, but, I wonder if it will work... My monitor(Hyundai L72S) only supports 1280x1024, not 1280x720... hmmm. soooo tempting.

Just found a thread about this box at http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=408882 no mention of resolutions, but looks promising! By accessing the service menu you can make it work on "any" TV/LCD/PJ... If your monitor takes 1280x720, I say buy the MoFo... Mine doesn't... More research is in order...

On the phone to Philips Support now... hope to find an answer soon... Arg... Tier 2 tech support... arg....

They didn't know the resolutions, so they told me to call back between 9am-3pm and talk to someone who might know... damnit... People on the AVS forum said they hooked one up to an LCD, but I don't know if that LCD supported 720p...

Yoder

Philips support is almost non-existent, probably some fat old guy with one eye. Make sure to post what turns up Yoder! I'm interested in this one

Ok, the guy over at AVS forum, jtnfoley, said this "CanterStage(SHOULD say Centerstage) CS1 is currently pretty cheap (I picked up one for $350USD delivered) and has VGA and DVI output, with highly tunable resolution output options.
The N6 (I've got one of these, too) can scale HD component, whereas the CS1 can only pass through VGA or DVI from another HD source."

You can DOWNLOAD new resolutions and settings off the INTERNET for this... It retailed new for $1999.99!!!!!!!!! Hmm... Found it as low as $212 on froogle, NEW sealed in box!!!!

You all can thank me later(and jtnfoley) hehe... I am buying one of these FOR SURE...

Link here to thread here...
There Review of the product is here...
It looks AWESOME... Boys, you have your replacement for the shi&&ty N6.(No offense to those who like the N6, I think it is alright). Here are the specs...

• High-resolution video processor provides video enhancement for high-definition display monitors, plasma panels and projectors
• Scales resolutions: 1365 x 1024, 720P, 1080i 852 x 480, 1024 x 1024, 1024 x 768, 1280 x 768 and 1365 x 768
• Download and install new resolutions with ease
• Flexible inputs support composite, S-video, YPrPb, RGB, 480/576p, and DVI
• IR remote, RS232, front panel control choices
• Supports all combinations of input and output aspect ratios of 4:3 and 16:9
• Input controls over contrast, brightness, saturation and hue

The CenterStage™ video processors, by Focus Enhancements, offer exceptional image quality, flexibility, features, and the latest in de-interlacing, digital video processing and scaling technology. With a combination of advantages usually found in the most expensive processors, CenterStage brings high-end performance without the high-end price.

While television, DVDs, tapes, and other interlaced sources look good on displays designed for their resolution, artifacts result when these sources are incorrectly converted for higher resolution displays. The scaling circuitry inside projectors or plasmas is typically primitive or only optimized for computer video sources. External line doublers, while better, only bring the source one step closer to the native resolution required by the display.

CenterStage functions as a resolution multiplier and upscales video to the full native resolutions required by today's CRT/LCD monitors, LCD/DLP/D-ILA projectors, and high-resolution plasma display panels.

Visible scan lines and flicker are eliminated, and the result is a picture with improved detail and color quality that is perfect for professional presentations and home theater applications. CenterStage accepts interlaced, progressive and digital inputs. Its output is pure, flicker-free, progressive video that is fine-tuned to your standard or high-definition display.

In addition to an easy-to-use interface complete with infrared remote and on-screen display, the full RS-232 capability (CS-1,CS-2 models only) allows for interfacing to Crestron, AMX, or similar controllers. Input parameters are stored to ensure consistent operation with all your video sources.

The CenterStage Video Processors CS-1 and CS-2 support the most common flavor of digital source and display standards, DVI. With DVI, or the Digital Visual Interface, video remains digital from the graphic source (PC, DVD, HTPC, etc.), through the CenterStage, and to the display (television, monitor, projector, plasma, etc.). CS-HD has DVI output only.

High-bandwidth Digital Content Protection (HDCP) is a content protection scheme optionally used with DVI to prevent unauthorized copying and redistribution of digitally perfect content. Original content via computer display cards or game consoles, and video from standard definition DVD players will not likely be content protected. High-definition set-top boxes are expected to be HDCP enabled to protect high-definition movies and pay-per-view programming.
CenterStage CS-2 has DVI and DVI HDCP in and out. (HDCP encrypted source material can only be output as HDCP DVI, so your display must support HDCP DVI. Un-encrypted DVI in will output as both DVI and analog)

• CenterStage CS-1 has DVI in and out, and is not HDCP compliant
• CenterStage CS-HD has DVI out only, and is not HDCP compliant

APPLICATIONS

• Home Theater
• Corporate Presentations and Training
• Rental and Staging
• HDTV Upscaling
• Video Installations
• Electronic Cinema
• Digital Signage and Advertising
• Format Conversion

CS-2 MODEL SPECIFIC FEATURES

• Standard DVI HDCP encryption
• Option slot for SDI Input option
• RGBS input support
• Time base correction (TBC)
• Rackmount brackets
• BNC analog video input connectors

OUTSTANDING FEATURES

• Scales to popular resolutions for monitors, projectors and plasma panels. New resolutions can be easily downloaded, installed and customized (CS-1, CS-2 models only)
• Flexible inputs support composite, S-Video, YPrPb, RGB, 480/576p, and DVI digital
• DVI digital, RGB and component outputs
• Infrared Remote, RS-232, or front panel control choices
• Backlit LCD status and on-screen display
• 3:2/2:2 Pulldown detection and correction for best viewing of film-based sources
• Supports all combinations of input and output aspect ratios
• Input controls over contrast, brightness, saturation,
  sharpness and hue
• Active buffered VGA pass-through
• Advanced comb filter input
• Luminance and chrominance noise reduction
• Auto-save memory for settings and input formats
• Screen Trigger Output
• Supports 4:3, 16:9 and Anamorphic Output Aspect Ratios

Here is another link http://www.focusinfo.com/products/centerst...centerstage.htm

Like it?

Well.... I can't seem to find ANY in stock at any online sites at a decent price... Sorry guys, it was too good to be true mabey.

Looks amazing! But before I pay too much I'd like to see it in action, if ya manage to get one Yoder can ya post some screens comparing your N6 to the CenterStage? Thanks
Trevor

Okay, I'm very confused now...

Why the sudden interest in the CenterStage? It's expensive, and the guy on AVS says it will not scale HD component, it only does pass-through (which makes it useless for those of us with 1024x768 monitors).

Also, did anyone get an answer on the output resolutions on the Phillips box? That's the one that really piqued my interest.

Thanks!

Ummm, I'm not sure but doesn't this imply that it does in fact scale?

Yeah, I'm even more confused now. The CenterStage sounds like a professional grade scaler (up/downrez). However, it's still sickeningly expensive (cheapest I saw was $750 for the CS-HD, which lacks some features).

I wonder if scalers will become cheaper as HD gets more popular, or will they just go the way of the dodo since so many TV's handle it internally?

Dweezilkid is correct. It will only scale standard resolutions up to those resolutions. It will NOT scale 720P or 1080i, it simply passes it through untouched.

This makes it pretty much useless for our purposes if you have any desire to display HD material.

Once again, I posted about the CS1, because I saw it for $212! So, for all you people saying"It costs SOOO much, more than my PJ!"... Yes, I know it sells for $1999.99 to $700 dollars... That is why it is a STEAL at $200-$300 dollars! At $400 is it quite a bargin, and is MILES above an N6 or TV9... This is concerning people who have seen both, and are not satisfied with the result of either units, like myself. Even though they are out of stock at the discount stores, and I considered keeping it to myself until I could buy one, I had to share the info! It was the "Lumenlab" thing to do...


Yoder

No, you are INCORRECT... Analog HD is scaled... Read the REVIEW I posted or the manual/user guide. DIGITAL HD, like HDMI and DVI are not. Neither is VGA input. 720p and 1080i over ANALOG COMPONENT is scaled.

Yoder

You've got it backwards:

On the very first page of the review it reads: "Though the CS-1 doesn't scale analog HD, it can scale digital HD."
So, if your HD components are using the component connections (as ALL of mine do), they will NOT be scaled, only passed through. The device should handle scaling of DVI and HDMI, though.

Ah... You are correct! It does say that in the review! I stand corrected! I did not read the review from front to back, and on second reading, I read that... Hmmmmmm... Sorry, that box sounds USELESS for almost anyone! Why the "custom resolutions" for computer monitors then! Maybe the review is wrong.

Yoder

Still, Yoder... thanks for the link. Keep hunting. There's got to be a better (reasonably priced) box out there.

I'll probably pick up an N6 in January just to get me by. I'm really thinking the solution lies in buying better LCDs -- hopefully the price of an LCD TV that accepts 720p and 1080i will continue to fall over the next year.

Well... I think the review is the ONLY place it says it only scales analog HD. I will call Centerstage maybe. And yes, I will keep looking. I will buy a TV9 if I dont have a solution by the time I am done building, to get me by. Dweezle, I'm glad other people aren't satisfied with an N6/TV9 and dont want an HTPC...

Ah HA! The review is incorrect!

From the press release... here.

CenterStage CS-1, at $1995 MSRP, upscales interlaced or progressive SD analog or HD digital to HDTV or native output resolutions. CS-1 features downloadable resolutions for native support of fixed pixel displays. CS-1 started shipping in June, 2002.


Also here....

CenterStage models accept composite, S-video, YPrPb, RGB, 480/576p, and DVI digital video, and scale these inputs to popular VESA, Projector, Plasma, HDTV and other native resolutions for monitors, projectors, and plasma panels. Outputs include: DVI and RGB or Component, 12-volt screen trigger, and a VGA pass-through.

SO... It would be PERFECT, in EVERYWAY, upgradeable(spelling?) and can grow with your options... I will buy one for $400-$500 dollars! Sheeee-iiiiit......

HD digital = DVI or HDMI. Component is HD Analog, so again, it will not scale HD input over component inputs.

Well wait a second... it says it scales YPrPb signals too. I had to go here http://www.keohi.com/keohihdtv/learnabout/...b_vs_yprpb.html to remind myself, but that should be any resolution carried over components, right? Correct me if I'm wrong!

I still think I would call the manufacturer to make absolutely sure before I bought it. The descriptions of all these scalers and things needs some SERIOUS work... they're never clear.

Oh well... I hope it works, and I can't wait to see you test if it does. You'll post lots of comparisons, right yoder?? You still have the n6 to compare, right?

You want to argue with the manufactures statements, ok, thats cool. You can believe a 3rd party review, even though IN the review, it sounds like it is upscaling analog HD, if you read that far, which I doubt you did. I personally believe the review to have a typo, and will call FocusInfo tommarrow, ASAP. So, buy an N6, be happy, and stop beating a dead horse. We have discussed HD-D vs. HD-A in scaling on this model, and I posted not one, but two links referencing two different press releases on this EXACT model of scaler unit. If you don't believe the manufacturer, ok.



Yoder


UPDATE: The review is on a Centerstage 1, Not a CS-1, maybe an older model.

I have just purchased a CS-1 on eBay for 405.00, quite a steal from the 1999.99 retail. I will post results as soon as I get the unit.

Yoder

hmmm..... 400 dollars for a box that does, only hopefully, what the 450 dollar computer I just built does Only my computer also functions as a DVR (commercial free no less!) and can burn DVDs, i.e. for backing up TV I want to save

Granted, I'm a computer-building type of guy and know how to source parts, have the time and will to wrangle with OSs, etc., so if that's not your thing, then this looks like a pretty good solution.

Oh, your a computer building type guy, as am I. My computer is built soley off of parts I bought at wholesale, or at pricewatch.com. My computer, and your's, will NOT do what this unit will, but it's good you can burn DVD's, that's a big plus. I do have satelite dual tuner DVR, but transfering the DVR to PC is quite a task. Furthermore, you're computer will NOT input ANY HD, unless I am wrong, which if I am, please tell me what tuner card you are using, and I don't mean OTA signals either. I will be using my HTPC WITH my CS-1, so I think HTPC's are good as well, they are just not convenient when my girlfriend/friends/family want to set down, turn on the TV/DVD and watch a movie.I am out of town quite a bit, and I my G/F would call me 10 times a day, "I get a fatal exception when I launch blahblah.exe!!!!" Also, this unit will deinterlace better than our PC's, unless you're using dScaler, which is very close. Also, as for that "not being my thing"(computers),I take offense to that! I have modded over 80 Xbox's, setup with linux(or OS of choice ), mouse, keyboard, printer, etc, on them, built computers for various people, and have troubleshoot for a few local business's...

Hey you two computer builder types!
What OS and DVR software do you use?

MCE?
or something more complicated?

I have a theory that I havn't really done anything with. I havnt even looked at hardware yet. But, if you had the right software, and hardware your computer could easily scale a HDTV signal both up and down. Now there are ATSC tuners on the market. If they have HDTV source inputs on them other than Coax. Say, a component in. It wouldn't be too difficult to whip up something....

Again. I would qualify this theory as pre-alpha phase idea thats not even on the napkin yet.

I wasn't talking to you specifically yoda, I mean everyone. Since i didn't have any home theatre equipment when I started my own quest, it worked for me to go the HTPC route. At some point I want to try the HD-3000 card found here: http://www.pchdtv.com/ Linux specific, no windows drivers thus far.

True enough, my 450 dollar computer would have to have been more like a 550 or 600 dollar computer to properly deal with HDTV. But since I don't have a HD source, at this point, it doesn't really matter to me. For me, there's just not enough HD content to warrant it yet. That and support for the HD tuners in linux is sketchy at best.

Kefka, I am using Gentoo Linux and MythTV. MythTV is great, but its not easy. MythTV IS rock solid stable though. Mine has been running, recording TV, etc, for a couple of months now with zero problems. I'm passing my video from my tuner card to my video card and using its S-Video output to get it to my TV. The reason I didn't go with MCE is due to security and reliability. Between it and regular cable from my "digital" cable box, I can see a noticable difference in quality just on my old, crappy 19in TV. Maybe this is due to some scaling, or maybe it is bypassing the limitations of my cable box, I don't know. I plan on passing an optical audio signal from my sound card as soon as I buy a reciever to support it.

Back on the topic, nice box let us know how it works out yoda.

The problem with every HD card I've ever seen is that they're all TUNER cards, not capture cards. You can tune OTA HD, but there's no way (that I've seen yet) to input any kind of HD material to an HTPC through any other connection (component, DVI, anything). I'd be perfectly happy using an HTPC if I could use it with say an xbox 360, ps3, whatever (in HD, of course).

It sure seems like there MUST be enough ppl who would want this kind of card... it must just be too expensive to make, or something.

Yeah, I agree, that's why I want a stand-alone. You show me a tuner/capture card that has yPbPr and I'll regret buying my CS-1, (MAYBE) until then, there is no viable alternative for me. I only have a few 480p device's now, and no HD(TV), but I want my PJ to scale up with me. I may get HD satelite soon, and would like HD inputs available, and I play xbox in 720p, and PS2 in 480p. So, for me the CS-1 was the way to go, BTW, there is one on eBay now for $0.99, and climbing, if anyone is interested.

Yoder

BTW Myth rocks!

Anyway I did do a little more research on it there's nothing out there but the OTA stuff as was feared.
And i'm positive that none of the cards do anything HDTV but output a component signal. So as of right now the independant box is the only way to go.

im all over the one on ebay yoder. so if any of you kind souls are reading this please dont bidd it up on me

Indeed capturing HD is a problem as I'm finding out. I thought an nVidia card that has VIVO (Video-In, Video-Out) would do it, but while some of them can output yPbPr, I don't think they can input anything other than s-video/RCA (see this card: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?...&ATT=14-170-090 for an example, the VIVO cable has yPbPr connectors, but I believe they are for output, not input, can anyone verify this?)

Luckily, I'm not worried about that part just yet I'm sure, with all the HD focus there is right now, that Hauppauge or someone else will step up to the plate soon. Until then, we'll have to wait for verification on quality on this box.

A while back I did an extensive search online and ended up actually finding a few component input cards. I didn't bookmark the pages because they were expensive $250-$400???? I can't remember.

Also, there is a chipset out there designed for HD video applications including HD component input. Then I did a search for all the cards that used this chipset, and found not a single one utilized the HD input feature.....maybe to save a few bucks because there isn't that much demand yet.

That is all I remember. Do a search. You have to dig, but they are out there.

I did see one card a while back that had component inputs, but it was only for 480i, and it was a relatively expensive card. I'm not exactly famous for my mad search skills, but I've been looking for a card that does HD over components for a while now, and haven't found anything. If you come across something, it would be great if you could post some links. Luckily I don't care anymore, since I'm getting minoten's wuxga kit (every input I could possibly need! well... except hdcp, but that sounds like it's coming).

Cool, I hope you get it! I hope you can get it cheaper than my $405.00!

Yoder

yeah, i dont think im going to spend quite that much, though it sounds to be well worth it. i take it all of the sites you found with $200-300 cs1 were all out of stock?

Yeah, of course... I have came to the conclusion that those prices are BS, and probably just to bait people to the site.

Yoder

Should have my CS-1 Tommarrow, will test it on a monitor, and my buddys PJ. Pics coming ASAP.

Hello,


Hello I have just finished reading this thread. All of my AV equipment uses component cables. PS2, gambcube, DVR, DVD etc...

I was thinking of purchasing a vdigi, but didn't see any discussion of it in this thread. I know other members have said this is worlds better than the N6 (search "vdigi"). Also very cheap. How does the vdigi stack up against the products you have mentioned here?

Link to the vdigi

Thanks a bunch!

LaDieu
---------------------------------------
P.S.

This seems like a good price on the phillips box.

There's many mentions of the vdigi in other threads, but I'll give you the gist of it to make it simpler. The Vdigi is a transcoder, NOT a scaler, so whatever resolution you're feeding from the source is going to be the resolution the monitor sees. The problem with this is that the monitor now has to do the scaling of the signal to its native resolution, and most monitors do a pretty lousy job of this. Secondly, if the monitor sees a resolution it can't handle, you simply won't get any picture at all - bear in mind most 15 inch (and even many 17 inch) monitors can't handle full HD resolutions. There's also the issue of having no control over the picture settings (color, brightness, contrast) so you take what you get.

Personally I would avoid the Vdigi if you want any sort of flexibility. In my eyes there are only two decent choices for scalers in a reasonable price range for a DIY unit: the N6 and the TVBox9. The TVBox9 has better picture quality but does not have HD capabilty. The N6 has mediocre picture quality, but does offer HD capability. In order to improve upon these you'll likely pay 500 bucks or more for a "real" scaler.

Of the 2 CMV LCDs and the 17" crt I have tried, all scale 640 x 480 to 1024 x 768 perfectly with zero image quality problems. I wish there was a list of monitors and how well each one scaled.

By the way, Yoder, have you got the CS-1 yet?

See here for review... Centerstage CS-1

The review has been moved. I am trying to reduce post redundancy, as people have expressed concern about duplicate posts.

Yoder

Yoder,

does it scale all inputs to 1024 X 768 for your lcd monitor.

Yes, it scales all mentioned inputs to...
640x480
800x600
1024 x 768 (XGA)
1280 x 1024 (SXGA)
1280x 768

NOTE: I have not had a chance to test 720p or 1080i yet, as my xbox is down for the count do to a corrupt EPPROM. Will test soon, I am going out of town on business for a week, on Christmas day no less, so I will take pics when I get back.


See here.