I just bought one for heck of a LOT of money. I have head nothing but great things about them so I'm hoping it is money well spent. However, I do have a concern... I'll have to wait and see, but a part of me is thinking do I really need a 400W bulb to drive this thing?

Are the results that poor with a 250W? I've been hoping that the removal of films from the LCD panels will allow us to use smaller lights, but today I just figured what the hell go get and that's one less thing I have to pick up.

Help me out here, I don't have a problem spending money on quality items, but was it a mistake investing in a 400W system?

(EDIT: just added some text to the title for clearer classification.)

IMHO it is the best game in town at the moment. If I was going to buy and electronic ballast that would be the one.

Who knows what the futures holds though. There are alot of very smart and creative people in this forum currently working on several solutions to make our PJs better. There comes a point though where you just have to go for it(An example would be people waiting for the Pro Lens). DIYers are always going to be trying to improve things so you will always be waiting if you are waiting for the best.

Yeah, that's somewhat the reason I bought it. When my reflector comes I want to start tinkering right away. I won't have my panel for awhile, but I have planned to build this in stages. The first stage is the Light Engine. I'm going to call me design the "Lucky Light Engine" - LOL

I was planning on the ICE CAP for a while, but some of the recent "discoveries" made me want to "wait and see". Maybe I am getting too optimistic, but it seems possible that we could go down to 250W setups if the removal of LCD films exceeds expectations. Commercial units do NOT use this much power, why should we?

Anyways, I have a good unit I think. The surprizing thing is that it does NOT look like the ICE CAPS that I have seen. I'll have to post pictures maybe, I hope it's just a revised new and improved design, but there is a chance I was flogged a cheap immitation. Yeah, I am going to take some pics. BRB

Good luck on the build. It is a blast.

Does anyone have one of these? Does it look like this?


The serial number is #172... that's somewhat low don't you think?





************************************************



This is the 400W MH EBallast from ICE CAP's website? Does someone think I have been taken? From the specs it is suppose to have dimminmg capabilities, the one I have doesn't.

http://www.icecapinc.com/aq.htm

is that the same one? vvv

cuz i bought that one for $120

i would be pretty dam amazed if it turns out to be a ice cap

I don't know if you have been taken but the IceCaps I have seen look like the pic from the website. They have all been black. FlyCRJ has one. You might get in touch with him.

jaigandhi5
Well that looks IDENTICAL except for the wiring. I have written ICE CAP and sent them the pictures. I am going to be PISSED if this is not an ICE CAP, I paid 2.5 times what you did (CDN with taxes). No warranty papers, no nothing... but some cheap printed labels that say "ICE CAP".


brianabs
Yeah, that's my thoughts aswell.. I've already written FLY CRJ and asked him(her?) to take a look.

I could probably get that supplier in hot water eh? That would be fraud no? I will be SO PISSED!

dont know if this helps..but thats the one i got...
http://www.nblighting.com/electronic_ballasts.htm

http://cgi.ebay.ca/400-Watt-Digital-Electr...1QQcmdZViewItem
(i contacted the seller through email and he sold one to me for $120USD shipped to CANADA.

jaigandhi
Thanks for that info, now I will have to wait and see what ICE CAP says. Who knows, they could be doing something like sourcing out to make more money, or perhaps they've liscenced their design to other companies. Either way, I WANT TO KNOW!

If I've been given a an imitation product, I am NOT going to take this lightly.

Lucky, got your PM.

My Ice Cap is black and its just like the one pictured on their website. It's much wider then yours.


Maybee yours is an older model? They usually go for around $200 US. I'd return it. I got mine from marinedepot.com

My model # is different too: PL-M-400-MH

FLY CRJ
Hi! Thanks for the reply. We'll we definitely do not have the same ballast, but we paid roughly the same price! I don't think it is an older model because this was stock that had just come it, they didn't even have it on the shelf yet. I too bought from an aquatics store.

If it is an ICE CAP, then I fear what they have done is to just source these out to China, which means that ICE CAP is no longer different from the other brands. If it is NOT an ICE CAP I'm going to shove it up the salesmans ***! He knew something about this when I inquired about the missing dimming wires. He was very confident when he 'knew' this model didn't have the capability.

Yes... if this is a cheap imitation I will help ICE CAP sue these guys. CopyRight infringement, fraud, etc. As a consumer I literally hate (a person shouldn't hate) being mislead. I personally thought I was buying what is shown on ICE CAP's website.

Thank you very kindly for the reply.

I wonder what the difference between PL-M-400-MH and PL-PAC-400-MH is?

Yor ballast looks like it may be an older model, but that is not necessisarily a bad thing. It looks to me like is is built better than the newer models. It has high temp sheathing for the lamp wires and comes with an actual plug on the power input. You may have been lucky and got one of the old good ones. Usually a company like that will start sourcing and using cheaper components as they grow to become more competitive.

I really can't say which might be better or even if it is a genuine Icecap, but I wouldn't assume that it is of poor quality.

Maybe your username is true.

Who knows? LOL, I guess I'll find out Monday. If you haven't noticed I don't like surprizes... I do like the amount of fins on the ballast, I don't think I like the weight, that thing is heavy! Anyways.. I'll just see what happens Monday, I bet you I could have bought the exact same one as jaigandhi5 for $80USD cheaper.

I have a question for FLY CRJ and for jaigandhi5 did you guys get any kind of warranty cards, or any type of literature in your box? Anything?

Man, I can't remember that far back I don't know where the box is?

just wonder, what lamp do you plan on using with your ice cap?

and could you tell me the values on the label such as input current, wattage... (i can´t read them).

thanks

edit; http://www.icecapinc.com/pdf/400mh.pdf very interesting info here.

i bought it from ebay....so i dont think i have warranty on mine...

but the seller said if it doesnt work i can send it back because he sells lots of ballasts....he has HPS and other ones.....

I don't know what bulb yet, probably the Ushio S400DD seeing that it is the smallest that I have found with acceptable Lumens, Colour, CRI, etc. In any case it will be a 400W MH.

You know the specs of this ballast do not match the specs on ICE CAPS site.

Input Voltage: 120V 60Hz
Input Current: 3.50A
Power: 415W
Power Factor: >0.99
Lamp: MH400W

well. This is a polemic point again; the ushio is not a standard MH 400W lamp.
It is more lika an standar HPS 400W lamp. (I like to say that the ushio is an HPS lamp, but it is a wrong statement as well, but keep in mind that it is a CONVERSION MH LAMP).

my veredict is that your ice-cap and the ushio are notcompatible, further points on it is up to you.

I will tell you some interesting points in my opinion;

1)the ushio's recomended ignition voltage is 2 Kvolts, and the ice-cap pdf information shows 4,5Kvolt starting pulse. Let me tell you as well the typical ignition volts on generic MH is 3 to 5 Kvolts. I believe the 4,5Kvolts will turn on the ushio, but i wonder if there is some damages to the lamp as well...

2)the ice cap specs pdf show that the lamp operating volts are in the range of 100-125 volts and somewhere 3.25 amps trhow the lamp. Those are perfect matching with generic 400W Metal Halides, but do not match with the ushio, not with the HPS generic ratings.

Just would like you to be aware of that. I would ensure about the setup before turning on / buiyng it. Sorry for making so much headackes ;D

Interesting choice of words... "polemic". Anyways, I know the Ushio S400DD is a conversion bulb, but it is still a Metal Halide lamp and I believe that it really does not matter. Most of tehse EBallasts are for MH and HPS, I should quote references but I am too lazy.

Furthermore, others use these - well the real ICE CAPs with the S400DD lamps and they have absolutely no problems.

Yes, the specs don't line up because this ballast is made for many MH 400W lamps, not just one specific brand/model. One more thing, Ushio simply RECOMMENDS 2Kv for start up, the ICE CAP states it has a MAXIMUM start up of 4.5Kv.

Thanks for the imput though rox.

sorry my obstination but if it was compatible with the HPS lamps (because if it is compatible ith the ushio it is with the HPS lamps, or is it me the only who sees this point?) don´t you think it would not have the "MH 400W lamp" label?

Why do you think all e-ballasts are all lamps compatible? i think the expensive e-ballast claiming HID e-ballasts (all kind) is becouse they have something "better" inside them.

Is there any simple e-ballast on the market? I suggest you to ensure the compatibility before proceding. But it is up to you.

It's ok Rox, sometimes we need a heavy critic. If this was the same ballast as as the one FLY CRJ uses and the same one that DIY Proc. sells, the same one I intended to be buying, then I would just use it.

From the "appearance" this ballast looks to be the same as this one:

http://www.nblighting.com/index.html?page=...tronic_ballasts

Please note how it is advertised:

"We offer the industry's best electronic HID ballasts at the best prices! Our Universal ballasts are capable of operating both HPS and MH bulbs automatically (with no switches to flip) and have many advantages over conventional magnetic ballasts."

howmuch is the ice cap? the one you have linked me is relatively expensive. I believe it to be a universal one. note it does not say MH- eballast but a universal one (thing that i believe to be very important)

why would you buy a universal one when all you need is a hps one?

Well, the ICE CAP that FLY CRJ bought was just a little cheaper, keep in mind the price above is an internet price. I think FLY CRJ paid $200 or his price is now $200. Yes, I am aware that this ballast does not say "universal".

I wanted an ICE CAP for reliability and I also wanted the ability to use different lamps.

Someone can correct me if I am wrong, but Electronic Ballasts slowly up the starting voltage until the lamp lights. That is why I am not concerned with those Specs rox. If you can find me the specs for S51 ballasts, and/or the voltage specs of S400DD bulbs while they are running I will look into "compatibility" issues. These are specs I haven';t found.

I'm not using this ballast until I talk to ICE CAP. I first want to know if this actually is an ICE CAP. Perhaps I will ask them about using HPS conversion bulbs with it and even HPS bulbs themselves (not that I will ever use an HPS bulb).

i have sent an email to icecap as well .

http://www.ushio.com/Files/UltraArc0604.pdf here it says 4.6 amps trhow the lamp. No info about the volts (we can stimate 400/4.6=87 volts as reference)

the 400 MH icecap specs claim 3.25 amps trhow the lamp, so I see a problem here.

Can i find a cheap 400W metal halide only e-ballast for my eye bulb on the market or i will never find what i am looking for? (i don´t have even an eye but you know what sarcasm tone is used for )

I guess we will just wait and see then, thanks for the help.

EDIT: One thing rox, the Ballast says INPUT CURRENT 3.5A, that doesn't mean it has an OUTPUT of 3.5A.

i was not refering to your ballast`s input current but to the original ice-cap specs online here; http://www.icecapinc.com/pdf/400mh.pdf

check that it says 3.25 amps trhow the lamp (in this case ther eis no stated the input current to the e-ballast only a strange critical case; 5.4 amps at 95 volts input power resulting 513 watts...)

anyway, let's see what do they reply. If they ask me to send a lamp, do not think i am soo interested on it ´, good luck, lucky you.

@#$%! Maybe you are right, I finally found a page that says the S51 is 5-7.6 Amps. But the funny thing is, FLY CRJ's projector looks great with the ICE CAP and the S400DD.

i never said the ushio would not power on. Just that it is not the propper setup. Maybe you are killing the lamp/e-balast... who knows what the hell could happen there...

I bet you the ushio powers on "well" on a M59 ballast (I always say this but nobody takes my challenge.... i guess because we read S51 ballast only for the ushio lamp all over the net... but no info about the e-ballast compatibilityes in exception of those universal ones called HID e-ballasts. HID high intensity discharge... assuming all kind of lamps).

if you get to a conclusion, please let me know posting here. I will do it as well. Maybe FLY has some input for us too

My impression is IceCap says this ballast will light ANY bulb as long as the wattage is 400. Isn't that the point of an eBallast? It's supposed to be able to figure out how to light the damn thing itself, and get the most out of the bulb.

I was going to post something like that earlier, but to be honest I am not as smart as I sometimes think I am. I do think however that these eballasts are built to self regulate for an optimum output.

We've been over this 1000000000 times.

ROX, A E-ballast is NOT a fixed OUTPUT. Why dont you understand that??

It starts the voltage low, and increases till ignition. At that point the voltage is high and the current is low. Current through the lamp climbs as the lamp warms up and voltage drops.

THESE RATED currents and voltages your reading on these E-ballast ARE AVERAGE values over a RANGE of different lamps.

The proof is in FLYCRJ, He has an ICECAP ballast, with an S400DD bulb. You can look at his plog and his results and CLEARLY see the QUALITY work he does. If the BULB was not reaching brightness or other operating conditions, HE WOULD HAVE KNOW it.

All E-ballast with the exception of some CHINESE one you found ROX, work in this fashion. All are switchable between HPS and MH lamps. The reason there is a VOLTAGE distinction given, is because of magnetic ballast that have a FIXED voltage output.

At some point, you can keep speculating, and speculating. However at the same time ALL evidence points to the fact they operate, and operate WELL. SPEC sheets are averaged values, nothing more. You read into spec sheets and numbers TOO MUCH. Use natural scientific logic and you will often come to your answer.

If a MH lamp DOES not meet operating current/voltage it will not be as bright but more noticeably it will NOT reach its correct COLOR temp. FLYCRJ's reaches correct color temp, and you can only get to that point if proper voltage/current is met to drive the lamp.

Simple as that, research done. Case closed. No need to discuss this anymore.

scubasteve2365
Thanks for the input. Now I just need to find out if I was actually sold an ICE CAP or an imitation.

All e-ballast with my only exception.... You are very brave on that statement.

all are switchable as well.... i wonder what is the diference on a 100$ MH 400 e-ballast and a 245$ universal one then.

Scuba, we know there are UNIVERSAL e-ballast, BECAUSE IT IS WHAT THEY CLAIM. Now assuming a MH one is universal is ONLY YOUR VIEW POINT. I will only trust the claims from the manufacturer, or the specs or whatever you would like to call them.

I believe the fixed current or volt on the e-ballast is the simplest/cheapest way to design an e-ballast. Then you can as well improve its capabilityes with some dimer options, multiple wattage lamp compatibility, AND different technology lamp compatibility.

You are assuming that MOST of the e-ballast are fixed wattage output controling, assuming a wide range of lap impedances (note the impedanze differencies on HPS/MH is twice value).

I asked you once if the manufacturers coments would mean anything for you, I got a suprising negative answer from you. I then stoped my investment, today Lucky me, reopened my curiosity and sent another email to ice-cap company. Even if you do not find it interesting, i would say Lucky would like to listen the reply (if there is any).

Finally; "Simple as that, research done. Case closed. No need to discuss this anymore"... this sounds very arrogant to me, sorry to disagree on that point.

Rox because your beating a dead horse and basically disagreeing with everyone.

You talk about rated voltages and other numbers so much, when you dont realize that those are just numbers, averaged numbers at that. Recreating in laboratory conditions.

You should know by now, that anything on a spec sheet is USUALLY not real world characteristics.

Youve been doing the same thing for along time now. I will refresh your memory.

Your first statement was that an S400DD was an HPS lamp. Deathray corrected you.
Your next statement was that LL E-ballast couldnt drive the S400DD. Brainchild corrected you
You then completly flipped and inverted by saying the LL E-ballast couldnt drive the Venture/Ushio/Eye lamps. You were corrected by showing that such deviced do exist Gadgetsmith showed you this I believe

All the while, Ive been telling you the exact same things these people have told you. Youll know that E-ballast do NOT have fixed output levels. But yet you keep bringing up numbers over and over.

Sorry for being negative. But you have to understand. youve repeatedly been making Claims and SPECULATIONS that UNDERMIME users that have used the PRODUCT.

STATING things such as, I dont think the ICECAP can power an S400DD properly, is COMPLETLY undermiming the experience of other users. In this situation FLYCRJ. Many people read forums, and draw conclusions. When you make statements like that you are discrediting members that were looked up to.

if you want to heirgo(sp) test and make scientific HYPOTHESIS then do so. But buy some product and run some test. Dont look a spec sheets and try to conclude all data from a PDF file. NOT GOING TO HAPPEN.

AGAIN, there is no reason, data, excuses or anything thereof to say that the ballast Lucky_Me has will not run the S400DD.

There is speculation on the legitimacy of it being the ICECAP ballast he thought he was getting, but you cant tell him the S400DD wont work on it, when it more than likely will.

hi scuba,

i have not kept up with this thread or topic, it has been about a year since i looked
into icecap ballasts working with HPS lamps. i thought i would share some
info from my past experience. excuse me if i'm out of date.

scuba why do you assume these are universal mh/hps ballasts? just because they
are electronic does not make them capable of driving a variety of lamps that
all have different operating parameters. just because a ballast will fire a lamp
doe not mean it is operating fine, it may overdrive or underdrive the lamp,
ballast my run at excessive temps, etc.

i had purchased the ushio conversion lamps in the 250 and 400 watt versions. i
had also purchased an icecap ballast at that time, around a year ago i guess.
at that time, icecap on their website, specified that these ballasts could run both
metal halide and high pressure sodium lamps. after looking at the drive
requirements for these lamps, i had concerns and contacted icecapinc.

to make a long story short, the engineers there told me that those ballasts
did not have the drive capability to run the HPS lamps, they were not
universal ballasts, that they were working on future ballasts that would be
able to run HPS. I informed them that their website and spec sheets were claiming
this capability. It took them about a half a year to take those claims off the website.

i will say icecap was very nice to deal with. they were willing to exchange ballasts.
also, they were willing to work at testing their ballasts with other speciality short arc mh lamps
i was interested in getting ballasts for, etc.

i ended up just using a normal mangetic s51 ballast for the s400dd .

i just looked at icecap's website. the ballast line up is still the same, and neither the
250 or 400 versions claim that they run HPS anymore. the smaller 150 units does though.

all this shows, is buyer beware. even when the manufacturer claimed HPS compatibility at first,
they were not. i would suggest that folks need to contact the tech folks, NOT SALES, at the
manufacturer if you want to know what is up with the current models.

its simple to say this.

While, I do not understand your particular experience you have described an abnormal condition. Did you ever run your S400DD on the ICECAP?

www.diyprojectioncompany.com They sell the a ICECAP with the S400DD. If it did not run it at all, then there are alot of people out there with ICECAPS that do not run the bulb.

Keep in mind the S400DD is a METAL HALIDE bulb. NOT AN HPS. HPS lamps are subceptible to things MH lamps are not. THE ONLY thing different about an S400DD are the slightly lower voltages the lamp gets at operating conditions.

SINCE the E-ballast is not at a fixed VOLTAGE level, then its capable of driving different loads. The same method applies to an E-ballast driving an ansi M59 EYE lamp, and driving an ANSI M135 PS lamp.

I cant speak for the ICECAP at your time of instance. The S400DD was a fairly new animal to us in the DIY PJ world at that time. But since, It has been used, and used effectively on the S400DD. When all scruntiny and speculations are at rest, we are still left at the end of the day with users that have used the equipment in question.

Your right, just because the lamp is firing doesnt mean its operating. I have a problem with my magnetic M135 ballast and the Venture/Ushio PS. It fires, and gets pretty bright. But does NOT acheive full brightness nor proper color. If the s400DD were being UNDER/OVER driven by the E-ballast weve hooked them up too, then how could they acheive thier proper color?

Im not claiming to be an engineer for ICECAP. Nor do I doubt your story. However, NOW at this CURRENT time. There is success with an ICECAP powering an S400DD METAL HALIDE LAMP.

I cant make a claim and say that it will run a TRUE HPS lamp, because I wouldnt know. However the SIGNAL that an Eballast gives is a higher frequency square wave. This High Frequency square wave may very well not be compatible with an ORIGINAL HPS lamp. However, it probably doesnt dictate the operation of the S400DD METAL HALIDE lamp. The only thing HPS about the S400DD, is that it can operate under the lowered voltage @60Hz sine wave. When Square Waves and increased frequencies come into play. The game changes.

"The ushio is an HPS" Is just something i still like to say. I know it is not true but it is energic. The only thing i mean with this stupid thing is that it is not a generic MH but a CONVERSION MH lamp, compatible only with HPS fixtures.

About the LL e-balast, i have nothing to say about, I have had long comunications with brain about it, who showed me very interesting points about the work being done with the manufacturer... He told me about some calibrations... I saw the LL-e-ballast could be a matching setup because BRAIN DID IT TO MATCH. But I still think the generic MH e-ballast as it is coming from manufacturer, it is not designed to drive the USHIO not the HPS lamps.

I fliped the LL-couldn´t drive the eye/venture...???? the only thing i could have said is that if it was modified to run the ushio, then it couldn´t drive the generic MH propperly until it is modified again.


About the claims and specs from the manufacturer, What the hell are they for? You say they are just numbers... they are the numbers you can complaint about if your item does not match them. This would mean the item is malfunctioning or that you have been cheated. A designer, designs only in base to those numbers. Then there is a real world test, but the thesign procces starts with a "why not working?" setup. If we start with a "why should it work?" design, it is a dangerous bet.

You are repeating that the e-balast is not a fixed voltage output. How many circuit diagrams have you seen? I would agree with you if you were talking about the UNIVERSAL ones.

I WOULD say the generic MH e-ballast is either a fixed voltage output or a fixed current output (never both at once) I would say fixed current is more comon/easier/cheaper but it is only a personal though, no proves. (I think you don´t have proves even).

you are right, DPC does sell the icecap+ushio. Does it make compatible? More people doing things wrong does not make it better.

Now a personal coment;

I said it was not my war more than once, well, It IS MY WAR. It looks like it is
me Vs all the diycomunity. I have sent several emails to manufacturers... have contacted people to hear about their case... But i do not plan on buying the stuff only to prove you it is not the propper setup. (And i said not the propper setup because it is proven that it turns on that it is bright that it is "well" working... but i wonder about the life, over/underdriven, color, efficiency...)

This last menbers experience is very welcome to me. Thanks for the input. I hope ice-cap will reply me today.

You move

just a coment here; it doesn´t say the 150W MH e-ballast is universal lamp compatible, but it says it is universal input voltage compatible, you can use it in usa 60Hz 120Volt or here in europe 50Hz 230volt no problem. But I would not use a HPS lamp with it not In usa not here

........hi scuba,

While, I do not understand your particular experience you have described an abnormal condition. Did you ever run your S400DD on the ICECAP?


........i did not run the ushio on the icecap ballast. abnormal? logic being the ushio lamp was designed
to operate on an hps s51 ballast, if the icecap was designed for this standard, like they claimed it
was, then it should run your general HPS lamps and also the ushio conversionn lamp. when it turned
out you shouldn't run a true HPS lamp on these ballasts, i went with conventional ballast instead.


www.diyprojectioncompany.com They sell the a ICECAP with the S400DD. If it did not run it at all, then there are alot of people out there with ICECAPS that do not run the bulb.

.............i never claimed that the s400dd would not run on the icecap ballast. i'm sure it does fire
and run, given your comments. It may run just fine, it may have problems down
the line, i do not know how well matched it is. what i said earlier was that the icecap would not
be a good choice to HPS lamps, as it was not designed for them. the ushio may be the wonder lamp,
that works well with both the hps s51 and the mh400 icecap ballast.


Keep in mind the S400DD is a METAL HALIDE bulb. NOT AN HPS. HPS lamps are subceptible to things MH lamps are not. THE ONLY thing different about an S400DD are the slightly lower voltages the lamp gets at operating conditions.



....i don't understand the above. yes that s400dd is a conversion lamp, designed to run on the HSP s51 style ballasts. it may be a metal halide lamp, but that doesn't mean it will run at its best with ballasts that load them differently than they were designed to be run. There have been a
few users that have tried to run the s400dd on the standard metal halide ballast m59 and
achieved poor results. the standard m59 metal halide ballast is much cheaper, and lighter than
the s51. ushio does not suggest they be run on the m59, it would be nice if it ran on this ballast.
the lamp clearly has different operating needs than a normal MH 400w if it doesn't run well off a normal m59, given reports of others.

SINCE the E-ballast is not at a fixed VOLTAGE level, then its capable of driving different loads. The same method applies to an E-ballast driving an ansi M59 EYE lamp, and driving an ANSI M135 PS lamp.

......just because the spec sheet for the electronic ballast says for instance a voltage range of 80-130,
doesn't mean it will operate lamps in that range at the proper current. i would love it if the icecap 400 would drive all my 400w metal halide hmp lamps at 95v. or hsr, hmi, and all the other types. unfortunately it is not a universal e ballast.


I cant speak for the ICECAP at your time of instance. The S400DD was a fairly new animal to us in the DIY PJ world at that time. But since, It has been used, and used effectively on the S400DD. When all scruntiny and speculations are at rest, we are still left at the end of the day with users that have used the equipment in question.


....... if folks like the way they perform together, great.

Your right, just because the lamp is firing doesnt mean its operating. I have a problem with my magnetic M135 ballast and the Venture/Ushio PS. It fires, and gets pretty bright. But does NOT acheive full brightness nor proper color. If the s400DD were being UNDER/OVER driven by the E-ballast weve hooked them up too, then how could they acheive thier proper color?


.......come on now, your not going to know, you need to test these under lab conditions. you could
easily under or overdrive the lamp a good percentage and not notice a thing or a change in color temp.
you could take an hmp lamp and drive 700w through it or 300w on dimming mode, color temp would
stay the same to our eyes. a large swing in lamp life though, and ballast heat. lamp life could go from thousands of hours
to 400hrs, and the lamp would look great either way.

There is success with an ICECAP powering an S400DD METAL HALIDE LAMP.

.....thats great. like i said, i'm not up to date and haven't seen any posts with folks using this combo for long term.

I cant make a claim and say that it will run a TRUE HPS lamp, because I wouldnt know. However the SIGNAL that an Eballast gives is a higher frequency square wave. This High Frequency square wave may very well not be compatible with an ORIGINAL HPS lamp. However, it probably doesnt dictate the operation of the S400DD METAL HALIDE lamp. The only thing HPS about the S400DD, is that it can operate under the lowered voltage @60Hz sine wave. When Square Waves and increased frequencies come into play. The game changes.

......in the end it is just a fun hobby. a year ago i did my best to sort this stuff out and deal the lack
of information as best i could. i would be nice to hear a count of hands from the folks using this
combination. chime in and let us know how bright your rig is and how you like it so far. all the best, tony

It's almost like a tag team wrestling match in here...

Look, I have not contacted ICE CAP nor USHIO about using this combination together and I suppose I should have rather than just assuming everything is ok because others are doing it. DIY Proj, FLY CRJ (with GREAT results!), I somewhat jumped in without looking.

You know what though, I think I am stuck with this ballast. ICE CAP wrote me today and told me that it IS their NEW ballast. So essentially I know that it is different than FLY CRJ's.

Now I guess I have a choice, buy an S51 and use the USHIO lamp, buy a different lamp, or just go ahead and use the ballast with a S400DD. If the lamp is reasonable bright, white and appears to be aceptable, then the only thing I have to worry about is the ballast doing something like getting too hot and becoming a fire hazard.

I'm not sure that FLY CRJ has that problem with the ICE CAP/S400DD, but I KNOW from reading THESE forums that many people here have that problem with brains EBallast. You can't tell me that that is NOT a problem, and his ballast you say is supposedly MADE or tweaked to work with the S400DD. Perhaps that's just a comfortable viewpoint.

Anyways, I think I will now write ICE CAP. I am disappointed because it is NOT what I thought I was buying.

bad news from ice cap;

We are not familiar with this type lamp. We would have to do testing on it
to see if it is compatible with our ballast or not.

> Hello, Sr;
>
> Just would like to ask about your 400W MH icecap e-ballast. Is it
> posible to use it with the ushio S400DD lamp? this lamp is a comversion
> lamp, this means that it is a MH lamp but was designed to fit on a HPS
> coil-core ballast (S51 ansi).
>
> You can see further details on the lamp here;
> http://www.ushio.com/Files/UltraArc0604.pdf
>
> I would like to hear your opinion about the compatibility of this lamp
> with your MH 400W no dimable e-ballast.
>
> Thanks, Gari.
>
>
>



so i haven´t get any valid reply from them. Of course i am not going to send them a lamp.

OK!!

I just got off the PHONE with the GENERAL MANAGER of ICE CAP. This is what he told me. The ballast that I have is the new version, the old version had nothing but problems. People were continually sending them back for warranty and the manufacturer was almost refusing to fix them by being incredible slow in performing the work. He doesn't think that company will be around very long.

Just so you know, ICE CAP does NOT manufacture these ballasts. Both the old and the new ballasts are manufactured overseas. The old design has been dropped he says because of routine failures, nothing but problems. Now this doesn't fit with what I have read from people's experiences, but moving on...

I asked him about competitors products looking identical to their new ballast. He told me that this new ballast uses a very common extrusion (the aluminum casing is manufactured by an extrusion process). So although it may look the same it will not be the same inside. That's what he told me - in my opinion your mileage may vary, but that's another topic.

I then asked him about running HPS -> MH Conversion Bulbs, specifically the USHIO S400DD with a lamp current of 4.6A. He told me that this has NOT been tested, but he would be more than happy to run the tests in his lab as they have the equipment to monitor the performance of the ballast. He just needs a lamp sent for this purpose, a small monetary investment (shipping) for anybody who wants to argue their case for or against this setup.

In any event, his opinion was that it WOULD NOT BE A PROBLEM for the ballast to run this lamp. He said as long as the bulb lights and runs STABLE, in other words as long as the lamp does NOT flicker everything will be fine. I made the point of adding as long as the ballast does not get too hot aswell, he agreed.

So there you have it, ICE CAP's answer. More than likely this setup is perfectly fine, but if anyone here wants to ARGUE or be "POLEMIC" then by all means buck up the $20 and ship an USHIO S400DD lamp to ICE CAP for laboratory testing.

I also commented to ICE CAP about their (in my opinion) unprofessional website, he said it is getting updated this week. All new pics, all new information.

Just one last note, ICE CAP is very familiar with DIY Projector... I thought he was going to think I was crazy when I told him what I was doing with this lamp/ballast combination.

Ok, I am going to proppose something to all interested;

we can make brain to ship one new lamp to them, maybe at its cost, and we can pay brain for same amounts (I will pay 1 part if it were lets say 5 interested at all)

But this would only show the icecap and ushio compatibility. Nothing more. Well, is there any interested?

Sure, I'll pay 1/5th of shipping. If I sent a bulb, I would expect it to be sent back! I will not pay for the "donation" of a bulb.

in that case i will pay 10$ of shipping. But i would like to send a new lamp to them, never used. Returning procces is not going to be my problem.

would you take the compromise of sending them the lamp?

Hi Rox,


You have to look a little closer. Yes it does say it can run HPS lamps, right on their website
under the the 150w ballast.


"Will drive any 150W Metal Halide or High Pressure Sodium Lamp"


thats what They claim


sincerely,

tony

yes, i noticed after posting. It is written scrooling down the 150W square box. But if you enter the specs pdf, there it does not mention HPS lamps at all but unversal power input.

I wonder which one is correct.