swill,

glad you like the box, i'm enjoying quite a bit myself

there's lots of things i'd like to change / would have done differently etc.. as i'm sure most of us feel, as you progress along the project, you always end up thinking of better ways to do something than they way you've chosen. first off i think i'd want to go for a bulb with a smaller envelope than the venture bulb i chose. initially i picked that bulb as it was one of the brightest 400w bulbs i could find, but taking into consideration arc length and trying to find a suitable reflector, i probably would have gone for something like the LL ushio now available ( especially since the pro reflector is available ).
i would probably also reconsider the threaded rod setup. it has its pros and cons. it allows for tuning of all the fresnel and panel distances, which is a good thing, but its a bit unwieldy to go in and have to adjust a bunch of nuts to loosen and re-tighten over and over again.
as for potential major upgrades, i've thought about the new pro lens as i'm losing some light and have some corner focuing issues with the 17" panel.. we'll see if i can convince myself to shell out the $$ for a new lens.

for the xbox i would think the vga input would offer you the best picture quality for your panel rather than going through a transcoder, but for ps2 you'd need a box unless your panel supports component vid inputs. there are some folks ( punish3r, chirstmas ) who have had great success with thier 360's so you could check out thier results. the vdigi has worked great for my gamecube.

glad you liked the pics. i tried to take as many as possible during the build, i have tons on my hard drive that have not been added to the plog. if there's anything you'd like to see more pics or want clarification on, shoot me a pm and i'll see what i can get for you. good luck with your build!

wow. google earth on a 120" screen... crazy.. the flyovers are nuts


good ol' NYC


highest point on earth



and some grand canyon pics.. this program is so cool!



i feel like i'm there... whoa

Comp_atkins, thanks a lot for the detail and attention you put in each step of the project. I am just starting my own 17" project and I am almost as excited as I am scared. Thanks again.

thanks! i hope your project goes well. enjoy the experiance!

Comp your engineering, and documentation are remarkable, and the projector is very nice, thanks for your plog!
Choppermn

thanks chop. though i cant take credit for most of the design, i borrowed from others.. esp. pun15her with the threaded rods and L framing.. thanks pun15her!

woo hoo! just picked myself up a brand new norpro off the trading post. thanks Rorshach! hopefully this baby will work out better than my current reflector solutions as i've not been quite satisfied with neither the ikea nor the target salad bowl. hopefully the larger bowl will work out for me. item was shipped today, so i'll be anxiously checking the mail these next few days in anticipation of pulling my pj apart again!


stay tuned

No problem! It was just going to waste at my place.

Good luck with the new reflector.
Those Google shots were cooooooolllllll.

Congrats on your projector. How far is your arc from the nearest wood point? Your not using any metal flashing I see. How come? I would have not you would eventually start a fire after a few hours of use.

thanks. my guess is my bulb is ~6" from the nearest wood... the insides are painted with high temp paint but i'm not currently using flashing, guess i never got around to it. i should probably add the flashing though as the box lid does get VERY ( 120+ degrees ) hot after a few hours of use. no fires started yet but i'm wondering if the paint on the box lid may start to blister or anything with the heat that the mdf reaches. i'll add that on the list to do when i replace the reflector.

in the meantime, more screens

i was trying to get a good angle shot to show the screen size with me in it and how high the image is from the floor. btw.. i stand a whopping 5'4"

screen res is set to 1280x720

Just awesome..... These PLOG's keep me going, that's why I just ordered more parts! Can't wait to get started.

Thanks again for the outstanding pics!

Post Office just sent me an automated message - your reflector has been delivered!

Enjoy!

yup, i checked the tracking earlier. thanks! hopefully i'll have time tonight to start playing around with it

woo hoo! my norpro arrived.. despite it being rather late at night i wanted to at least get the notch cut for the bulb and just see if it performs better than the current reflectors, even if i dont have a permant mounting setup for it yet. i wanted to come up with a way that i could comare the 3 reflectors quickly, but just holding it behind the bulb and trying to comare the light output i get from the triplet. while messing around with the bulb with the fresnel / lcd assemble removed from the pj i came up with this setup.



basically i have a piece of paper attached in front of the triplet ( i guess @ the focal point of the triplet ) which projects the bulb arc perfectly.

closeup of the projected arc



my comparison technique consisted of me holding the reflector behind the bulb while inspecting the resulted projected arc. i'm guessing a perfectly aligned reflector will show on the paper an entire clearly focused second arc overlapping right on top of the primary arc projection.

i was never able to get a clear 2nd arc projected with the ikea, i'm guessing the bulb is too big to allow for perfect placement of the arc at the focal point. unfortunatly the 2 seperate arcs, one clear ( primary ) and one blurry ( reflected ) do not show up clearly in the pics.. but you can see my thumb holding the reflector right before the heat from the bulb burnt it a little bit while i was trying to take the picture. ouch!


here's the norpro for comparison.. again, the picutre doesn't help all the much but i did see a much clearer second arc showing up though i think i need to cut my notch a tad deeper as i could not get it to overlap the primary projected arc without it going out of focus.



so i'm pretty convinced the norpro will make a much better reflector for my bulb. i just need to come up with a good way to mount it so i can get it perfectly aligned... and go ice my thumb

night all!

Comp,that looks like a nice crisp image you got there,congrats!
I like the reflector alignment technique!
Are you a F1 fan???
I will be watching the Aussie GP at 3am on sunday!!
Cheers P

pun,

yup. in the past few years the sport has really grown on me. saw nearly every race last season... though this year i've been very busy with work on weekends that i have not had a chance to catch any races yet.. i'm curious to see how the new v8's are doing. who's your driver / team? i gotta go with the ny yankess / man u. ( pick your sport ) of F1 and support the prancing horse ( as you can tell from my desktop pics )

Yup,I am a big Schumacher/Ferrari fan,but I do have a soft spot for my homie,Button with the Honda!
My son is a Williams fan.(The rest of the family hate it,which is why I like getting up for the early ones,that way I get to watch it with no interruptions! )

As everyone else has said, excellent job, thx for sharing the info.

I looked all through your plog and never saw what focal length your fresnal are. Are they the 220/330?

I'm asking because I'm in the process of upgrading the 15" to 17" with standard 15" lenses (larger fresnels ofcourse).

I noticed in your paper technique that the ikea SS has more ambient light in the room than the norpro. Is this because of the reflector or just the circumstances of the pic? If it's because of the reflector, then the norpro definatly focus's the light back to the source better.

Last one, where did you get the norpro? Link?

Thanks Again dude. You've helped with mounting ikea, blackout cloth, AG striping, and a few more I just cant remember them all right now.

L8R
Camaro

camaro,

i am using the standard 220/330 fresnels that the 15" plans called for. when deciding to go with a 17"-er the pro lenses were not yet available plus i didn't want to spend a forturne on new lenses giving that i wasn't even sure if my pj would succeed so i went for the standard setup. i'd seen other's with success using the standard fresnels.
the ambient light in the picture is due mostly to the light leaking out the top of my box while i'm holding the ikea againt the bulb. since the norpro is much bigger, it envelops the bulb more and blocks a lot of the light escaping from above the bulb, hopefully reflecting more of it but i doubt light at the out edges of the bowl gets reflected back into "useful" light.

here's a comparison of the sizes of the reflector's i've had


here's just the norpro


in the testing i've done so far, the norpro is better able to create a focused, "reflected" arc projected onto the paper than the ikea or the target bowl i had been using. so i'm pleased i was able to pick it up.

i picked up the bowl on the trading post forum actually.. when starting my pj i had been searching for a while online and in local stores without success as they've been discontinued, which is why i ended up with the ikea in the first place. a few days ago i saw one being offered on the trading post and snatched it up. got lucky i guess there may still be some availble if you keep searching.


---------

anyone know the best way to polish these stainless steel bowls? what the best technique / product to use? should i bother sanding first with a very high grit paper? i'd like to get the maximum reflectivness out of the bowl as i can.

ok i think i've figured out a way to mount the reflector to the mogul and make it adjustable relative to the bulb in 3 directions.. so the bulb / reflector will be able to move relative to the fresnel ( as it is now ) and the reflector will be able to be optimized relative to the bulb. this should allow for plenty of fine tuning.

i also added flashing to the lid above the bulb so the lid will stay nice and cool now. if work goes well this weekend, i may have some time to get the reflector mounted by sunday

i also want to remount my field fresnel in its frame as it its a little bit bowed.. man everytime i open this damm box up, i find something else i want to work on.. it never ends

On the flashing on the lid.... do you just attach the flashing directly to the lid surface (so it's in contact with the wood) or do you leave a slight gap (air pocket) to help keep it cool?

Great idea with the rod and paper, I'll be stealing this one as I fine tune my setup (soon, soon, ah yes, soon).

swill, i didn't leave a gap between the flashing and the lid, just attached it right to the wood. have not yet fired the bulb up with the flashing installed so i dont know yet how effective the flashing has been

i've managed to get 80% of my norpro mount assembled. took a bit longer than i anticipated but i guess anything pj related tends to be that way.

first off, since i'm adding much more weight to the mogul sled than used to be on there with the ikea or target bowl, i decided i need a way to keep the sled in place vertically and not slide all the way down to the bottom of the tracks once everything is installed. i installed a threaded rod / knob and a piece of aluminium. this will keep the sled in place vertically and allow for fine tuning



gorilla glued a nut into the top of the mogul mount to thread the rod though. works very well


glueing the aluminium in place.



now here's the basic setup for the reflector mount. its pretty much the sama as my target mount in that its framed off of the mogul and moves as it moves. the bowl will be mounted to a small sheet of project plywood and then the ply will be mounted via L brackets to more aluminium.

started by cutting 2 strips of aluminium and also cut slots in them so they can be loosened from the mogul and slid forward / backward relative to the bulb. once the reflector is mounted this will allow for the arc to be centered at the bowl center of curvature.





next cut another strip to add stiffness to the back and provide a point at which to attach the ply. also mounted the bowl to the ply. will also cut a slot in the ply to allow for another axis of adjustability for the bowl.




here's the setup as i've gotten it done so far. need to get some more fasteners in order to complete it ( hence the c-clamp in the pic) and i also need to use a thicker piece of ply to mount the bowl as the piece i used is rather flimsy. i was trying to save a bit of weight. i also need to add another L bracket to strenghen the ply's connection to the aluminium cross brace. played with adjusting it a bit and its a little cumbersome to have to loosen and tighten a few wing nuts but it gets the job done.



also did a test fit to ensure everything will actually fit in my box. everything fits


i'll be stopping by lowes tomrrow to pick up the few odds and ends i need and with a little luck the pj will be up and running again tomrrow night!

Very nice results! Are these last results stull using a 320mm lens? How is the sharpness in the corners?

I've got my hands on a hitachi 17" sxga with a broken backlight and I'm planning to use it for a diy pj. I allready have a 400w hqi set and a 320mm triplet so I just have to order 395x395mm fresnels.

yeah, i'm still using the 320mm fresnel. the corners are still a little bit out of focus with the 17" panel, but only really noticable when displaying the computer desktop ( which i now display widescreen anyway )

good luck with your project!

FILTHY SICK IMAGES COMP!

damit! in the process of uploading more pics, i missed 1-2-3-4-5-6 ( 1:23 AM on 04/05/06 ) oh well, i'll have to catch the european version next month..

so anyway, time for another update... wow this pj stuff is starting to take over again. and with work outta control now, its wake up, go to work for 10-12 hours, come home and work on the pj for another 3-4.. sleep is for the weak i guess

so anyway, tonight i go to testing out the new reflector mount..

powering the box on


i pretty much used the same technique as before to line up the true and reflected arcs projected onto a sheet of paper.



you can see in the close up there are two arc tube supports showing up in the projection, the lower being the true one and the upper being the reflected one. the pics do not show it but the two arcs are pretty much on top of one another. i hope that light ring around the edge of the bowl does not muck my image up. if so i might have to black it out with a little paint.


once i was satisfied i could line everything up well, it was time to pull it all apart and get some paint on it


while i had the box in pieces, i also wanted to flip my field fresnel frame around so that i can get it closer to the lcd. this required me to not only flip the frame but also flip the lens to its still pointing towards the lcd. so i'm re-gluing that now as well. it should be all set for tomorrow.

lastly, while @ lowe's picked up a 30" hinge i figure i'll use to hinge the pj lid. unfortunatly, its a little too long for my box. so i took it apart and will cut it down to size tomorow.


enough for me tonight. time for much needed sleep so i can do it all over tomorrow. unfortunatly tomorrow is lost so i'll have less time at night to work on the pj. night

That's weird... I have the same toaster oven and the same countertop material in my kitchen.

oh... and I like your adjustable mogul mount design.

that oven has made like 80% of my meals over the past 2 months

quick update, i got my reflector mount assembled, norpro installed and aligned, and fired the pj up. image definatly looked brighter with the new reflector so i'm pretty pleased. sopranos last night looked great

pics to follow once i get them off the camera

Looking great Comp!

Really like the adjustable mount you made for the mogul. Can't wait to see the pics!

got pics of the completed reflector mount for my new norpro



installed in box


lighting up my kitchen


getting it all lined up


and lastly... some shadow puppet fun




screenshots to follow.

watched sin city tonight... damm good flick if i do say so very dark movie really but didn't notice much loss of detail with the pj.





uh... yeah.. wow.

Nice Comp!

Great screen shots.

After seeing your paint job, my son is painting the outside of our box (when it's done). XBOX360 logo, of course and Halo2. He really liked your logo.

thanks! the 360 logo will definatly look sharp on the box. good idea

btw.. the flashing made a huge difference with the temperature of the box lid.. without it, the lid very hot to touch after a fairly short period of time. i've had it running now for over 3 hours and its only warm. only problem is i skrewed the pieces down rather right and the flashing bows a bit when it gets hot. no big deal really just something to think about when installing the stuff.

Thanks.....

I picked up the sheet metal at Lowes on last night. My son had a blast shaking it all through the store making thunder noises.... and then scaring the dog when we got home.

I'm going to attach some of the sheet metal to the top and build a shield around the lamp and reflector to protect the wiring and ballast.

Tomorrow is fresnel cuts and frames for the sled.....

put together a few before / after shots using the ikea and the norpro for comparison purposes. i made sure to use the same camera settings for both photots and tried to take pics from same location for each shot. ikea is on the right, norpro is on the left. really cant tell much difference in pics, but like all screenshots, look much better in person

that diypro testcard everyone has..


now just a plain white image



i want to get a few movie frames for comparison too. problem is i dont have the camera settings written down for 95% of my screenshots so i'd just be guessing that the comparisons are apples to apples.

I was thinking of getting the pro reflector from here at LL, but was looking for input, how would you rate the various ones you've used? Also do you think it would be worth it to upgrade to the pro lenses? I was thinking if all else to get teh pro Fresnels and maybe the normal triplet, not sure if the extra $ would be worth it.

Since you're not sure of the camera settings, it's hard to tell. But the left side of the blank canvas looks a little better to me (maybe that's because I'm installing the pro as well).

Can't really tell on the test pattern, but hey, it still looks fantastic.

for those two pics, i'm sure the camera settings are the same. but i agree, you cant tell much difference from the pics. i'm thinking of polishing the bowl to get the optimum reflectivness out of it but i'm dont really know what the best technique is for polishing. should i ust use like chome polish or should i wet sand first?

i definatly think the pro refletor is the way to go from what i've seen from others' projectors. my bulb is too large to use that reflector but the ll T15 bulb is perfect for it. i think the norpo is prob the best reflector i've used, but since i dont have any hard data to back that up, its really just opinion if you're using a 15" panel, i dont know if you'll need the pro triplet or not. you'll get more brightess using it i think but does that justify the extra cost?

hee hee.. even with the pj being ~7 months old, i still get a kick out of firing this sucker up and watching a good movie.. cant believe we're able to build these things

just a quick update, i've been seeing a bunch of screenshots w/ tv's on in the frame as a reference for size and brightness so i thought i'd do the same.

tv is a 21" but i measured the tube at a mere 19.5"... so much for truth in advertising...


and of couse with me in the pic to add to its value



night all!

I am also about to build a 17 inch beamer so would you say the standard triplet focuses your 17 inch lcd perfectly corner to corner?

nah, i dont get perfect corner to corner focus w/ the standard triplet and a 17" panel. its really only noticable with my computer desktop displayed though, and the clock / menus are still readable, just not prefectly focused.

Ok. so what triplet do you recommend to get perfect corner to corner focus. Please dont say pro triplet. I mean is there any cheap triplet that will do the job? I thought i heard someone say the triplet from a specific ohp works perfect with a 17 inch.

I forgot to ask you. Do you notice the soft focus during widescreen or 16:9 movies? Have you done or can you please do a test with 16:9 image focus chart to see how the focus is?

comp, that Spider Man 2 screen is seriously one of the best if not THE best screenshot I have seen on here. How in the heck did you get such good corner to corner focus?? I haven't seen someone achieve corner focus like that, well, ever. Oh and I haven't read through this whole plog, did you remove your AG?

thanks blake! the widescreen media does have great focus corner to corner. for fullscreen the corners are a little bit out of focus but for most movies its never an issue