Hello everyone, and welcome to Build II.

My mini-HAAS design has been out of commission since before my move back West in November of 2008. I really miss the big screen! Things are not the same watching movies on a 22" monitor. I'm in a new place (still renting) and my mini-HAAS design isn't really suited to my room. I've decided to try my hand at a folded horizontal vertical. Wanting to put a little spin on it, I decided to flip a vertical build head over tail - and place the lamp at the top.

I'll be using the same parts that I used in my mini-HAAS but I'll be making a different LCD/Fresnel "cassette" (necessary due to the fold) and a new enclosure out of the same 1/8" MDF.

Parts List (same as the mini-HAAS):

I've tried to buy what I can locally (while still in Ontario), in order to save on shipping related charges (customs, brokerage fees and the like) that we Canadians must face.

I'm going to be building an Inverted Vertical Folded Horizontal box using the 12.1" LCD with the MST controller.

12.1 Toshiba LTD121LX8S (Rev.Z) LCD kit w/ MST9E19V1.22B Controller 720P ($265.00 - I managed to obtain one before the price jump)
200mm & 320mm Fresnel Lens Kit ($35.00 - Pre-cut - Yay!!!)
Ceramic HID Lamp Box Kit W/ Reflector & Precondenser Lens ($40.00)
($405.00 Shipped - Only $35 for shipping - FedEx International Priority - with no additional charges)

Switched to LL S15 Triplet - Thank you LL!

150W Venture Lighting Metal Halide Ballast
According to the bulb box, I needed either an M81, M102 or M142 ballast.
V90D7110 150W M102 60 Hz (unfortunately, there was no mounting hardware included)
http://www.venturelighting.com/VLPS/Ballas...MH/V90D7110.pdf
I had originally contacted Venture Lighting via their website (as they have a location within Ontario - trying to keep shipping costs down) and asked them for a quote. I got a reply back asking to provide my address and they'd send one out. I took this to mean that they would be e-mailing me back with a quote once they had my Postal Code. Imagine my surprise when I came home from work one evening and found that they had FedExed one out to me! The invoice was even marked Prepaid! I'm not sure if this was a previously used ballast, or not, as the wires are stripped at the ends. I'll be able to provide some pictures next week when my camera gets here.

150W USHIO DE Metal Halide Bulb - CMD-150/TD/942/RX7S ($67.85, including taxes - Bought locally from Buchanan Lighting - "Light Bulb Experts")
http://www.ushio.com/files/specs/Ceramique.pdf
Tyler of Buchanan Lighting advised me that they will ship to other Provinces. Contact them for pricing - Send an e-mail to ernie AT buchananlighting DOT com.
http://www.buchananlighting.ca

12V DC 1.5A Regulated AC Adapter ($39.89 - Purchased locally from The Source - Used to be Radio Shack)
Yes, I know I paid too much but it would have cost me just as much to ship one - it's hard to find anything above 1000mA, locally.
http://www.thesourcecc.com/estore/Product....product=2731779
I read in one of the threads that as long as you're not using the backlight, you only need, at most, 1300mA. I powered up the LCD before stripping it and it seemed to function well.

For my cooling and heat monitoring:

EverCool EC-PCAC Fan (moves 100 CFM)
http://www.aerocooler.com/shop.cart?action...od_id=FANECACBK

Two (2) Scythe TM02-WH KAMA THERMO Thermometer (Celsius - they have one that does Fahrenheit, too)
I'll have one monitoring temperature at the LCD and one closer to the light box.
http://www.aerocooler.com/shop.cart?action...rod_id=FANSCTMC

The PCAC fan has a three pin connector and the two thermometers have four pin connectors. These will be plugged into the following:

Thermaltake Power Station Mini Box...
http://www.aerocooler.com/shop.cart?action...od_id=FANTT2359

(These last three items were $66.28, Shipped. Once again, I'll have to wait and see if there are additional charges once received)

...Which will be powered by this adapter:

AC to DC Adapter, 110v AC to 12v DC converter ($21.41 Shipped, USPS - We'll see if I have to pay additional charges when it gets here)
http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/ind...oducts_id=22607

Using this combination of AC adapter and the Thermaltake Power Station Mini Box, I won't have to void any warranties on the PCAC and thermometers due to stripping the wires. Should they not function, or cease to function, within the warranty period, they could easily be returned.

Next up, I purchased a DPST switch (The Source - used to be called Radio Shack as mentioned above - only sells SPST switches), power entry module and AC power cord from the local Active Electronic Supply Store ($19.86, including taxes). Here's a link to their store locater if any of you fellow Canadians want to find out if there's one near you:
http://www.active123.com/b2c/storeLocator/...=storeLocator_1
Thanks for the link, infinityPlusOne!

I also picked up a 15 foot VGA cable at a local computer store ($25 - again, it would have probably cost me as much to ship it).

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I've been spending the past week modeling my enclosure using Google Sketchup (I managed to find a full copy of Google SketchUp Pro 7 kicking around ).
I'll be posting my models to the Google 3D Warehouse (http://sketchup.google.com/3dwarehouse) for those who might find them useful. Just do a search for Lumenlab.

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My throw will be close to 10' which will give me a 16:10 screen of about 110" diagonal.

Here's some handy information I got from the Home Theater Calculator Excel spreadsheet for getting your screen width and height measurements.

Here are some preliminary images from my Google Sketchup work, so far:
(click on thumbnails for larger image)

Isometric View:


Front View:


Right Side View:


The measurements, so far, are 12" wide x 12" deep x 22" tall. Access to the inside will be via the rear of the enclosure. This way, I can smooth the edges on the outside of the enclosure and make it seamless.

Oh I can't wait to see this one!!!

BTW, if you take the (( ?action=view&current= )) out of your photobuxcket links the thumb will link right to the pic and not to the rest of your album. Just in case you didn't know. (( You are sorta the webby guru round these here parts ))

Thanks for the hint, Windcalmer - that was really bothering me, but I had not investigated it yet.
That's much better!

Cool beans. I have been trying to get them to change the linking system back the normal one. It drove me nuts till I found that to take out.

the box below the mirror in the right side view is the ballast right?

Yeah, that would be the ballast I am pretty sure. One of the regular ones, not an E-ballast.

Good on you Quas, looking forward to viewing progress on you 2nd build.

Just 1 little note though, have you done some research on down shooting folds? Check elken2004's and I beleive ColdSteel's. They, too, have tried it and found that the salts in their 400w lamp settled in front of their bulb towards the lcd due to gravity. They found discoloration on projection because of this. However, I noticed your working with 150w'r so I'm not sure if this will be the same.

^^^ Glad to see that someone has mentioned that. I had always seen the salts in my 400 watt bulb pool at the bottom, and had wondered about some of these inverted builds.

((Glad to know that I am really starting to get the theory of these PJs. LMAO))

To tell you the truth, SIMUL8R, I had not even thought of that. I was just reading through Cold Steel's vertical PLOG and saw what was happening to their HQI lamps (salt deposits). I've just now checked my ceramic metal halide lamp, and there doesn't appear to be any kind of deposit on the inside of the arc chamber. I don't think I'll have the same type of problem as they had with their HQI lamps.

I found this PDF about the make up of (GE) ceramic metal halide lamps which was an interesting read.

I had forgotten about Diygeek's "Invisible" projector, which was another inverted vertical. He found that he was not having the same problems as elken2004 or Cold Steel.

bevo77 switched his vertical to an inverted design when he switched to a CMH lamp. He never uploaded pictures of the finished setup, though, and ended up building a third projector as a horizontal folded before killing his LCD. He never said why he gave up on the inverted vertical, though.

Hmmm... I think I'm going to test burn the lamp in an inverted position and check it out. I just found this post from elken2004 concerning upside down burning of a 150W CMH lamp. I also see something of a "shadow" on the bottom of my lamp.

Looks good, Quasi.

A couple of suggestions (Take 'em for what they're worth)

The slots for cooling being in front might be less than desirable. There's always light leaks from those unless you take great pains to avoid them, which also impedes airflow. Maybe put them on the back side of the projector instead, so that any light leaks go away from the screen.

I'd be worried about the position of your controller, as well. I personally like to keep those cool, as microchips + heat = death. It can be done to have the controller in front (or in this case, below) the LCD. I did it (albeit temporarily) with my pro lens build when I was playing with a folded light path. It just takes a bit of worh with the LCD sled. Not even that much work...

Suggestions are always welcome.

I was thinking about making some kind of gentle "S" curve for the air intake on the front. At the very least, a hood of some sort to divert any possible light leak down.

I was planning to have an aluminum heat shield positioned between the controller and lamp. I would like to have the controller beneath the LCD, but I wasn't sure how long my LVDS cable was - everything has been packed away since the move. I've been thinking about building my own lightbox to replace the one I purchased from johnzo. Maybe something made out of aluminum with louvres at the top to allow the heat to escape.

On a side note, after a very long 13 months of unemployment, I just signed my job offer letter today for my new position. I'll be pulling in twice what I was making at my previous job. Yay for me!!!
The "bad" news is that it's more of a permanent position and the job has seriously derailed my plans for backpacking to Vancouver and setting up residence there. I think I'll live with it.

Here's a couple pics of my lamp. This is after probably several hundred hours of burn time. I don't think what we're seeing here is any sort of "gravity" deposit, as the same thing appears on the opposite side (top) of the arc chamber.

Just I've figured. I noticed no deposits with my 400w ceramic Philips nor the 150w when I had them. I guess your good to go.

I've decided to extend my OSD button board and remote sensor so that I can place both of them on the front of the enclosure. Would I be able to use an old floppy cable or EIDE cable (cut to correct width) to extend them? They look like they're the same type of cables.

wow your controller looks identical to mine other than a single heatsink, still have annoyances with mine and cannot fine any info at all

floppy / eide is built for quite high data bandwidth, i bet it would be suitable, no harm trying eh?

Based on my previous experiences with extending a variety of similar cables I suspect you'd have no problems doing exactly what you described.

Thanks guys!

In my searching, I found many references to others who extended their remote sensor, but they never stated what they used to do it.

Just found your extension here, Durachko. Do you remember what gauge wire you used - and do they need to be twisted?

If you are talking the IR sensor, then twisted 22 gauge under 15 feet should be fine. We use to use short runs for home theater stuff when I was doing home automation.

Ditto Wind. I prolly used 22g "bell" wire or similar. Whatever I had lying around.

Would mounting the lamp on a slight downward angle let the salts run down towards the tip of the lamp away from the arc and minimize any problem or does the arc chamber have to be perfectly square to the rear fresnel?

Not really, no.

As long as the lamp is a "universal" burn position lamp, then it doesn't matter what angle the lamp is at in regards to the LCD. Some like a vertical burn, as many lamps perform better that way. Horizontal is the easiest to center, and generally makes for a smaller projector case, but many people have used a diagonal lamp because their cases weren't wide enough to center a horizontal lamp.

It won't really affect where those salts deposit, and even if it did, it wouldn't affect where they are while the lamp is burning.

i have seen universal burn lamps in all positions here on the forums , but i always belived a horizontal burn position was best for me
only because i move the lamp foward, back , up and down alot early in my builds to get proper lighting distance.
i tried mouting my 400w on an angle to make a smaller box once, but found it was a pain to move and keep center

I thought the salts would follow gravity and only settled to the lowest point when the lamp was cold. As I understood it, the potential problem with a horizontal where lamp is above the fresnels / lcd is that the salts can deposit on the bottom of the lamp facing the fresnel and over time leave a buildup of stains which could affect the light. My thinking was that if the lamp is sloping so the tip is a bit lower than the base wouldn't that stop any deposits from settling in the middle centre area and keep them out of the way of the light arc. Wouldn't they tend to settle on the bottom but closer to the end of the lamp?

If I ever get around to rebuilding, one design I'm considering is not exactly like Quasi's but it has the lamp above like that. I had concerns about this design when I first read about the salt issue some time ago and this is something I thought might work.

btw) I'm not talking about shifting or angling everything to stay parallel to the lamp (which would be doable but a bit more complex). I'm hoping that wouldn't be necessary with only a slight incline and from the viewpoint of the fresnel/lcd/triplet would only reduce the "perceived" arc width minutely.

Alrighty...

I'm seriously considering scrapping the vertical folded build in favour of a horizontal folded. I've been designing the vertical in Sketchup for the last week or two and, while it's do-able, I think I'm going to opt for an enclosure that's 12" deep and about 10" tall, rather than an enclosure that's 12" deep and 22" (or so) tall.

Here's my Google Sketchup (unfinished) of the vertical design, in case anybody is interested. I was planning on scrapping the single horizontal air intake slit for a larger area "tribal" type dragon cutout, ala pun15her's amazing cutouts.

I'm going to be hacking together some IKEA shelving and I'd rather have the extra shelving space.

In case anybody is interested, my IKEA hack will be done using an EXPEDIT bookcase (Birch finish) on top of a couple of the 16" BRODER L-Feet with the 80" BRODER Posts. I'll then be attaching three of the 43" LACK Shelves (Birch finish) to the BRODER Posts, above the EXPEDIT bookcase. My computer printer (Canon MP530) will sit on top of the EXPEDIT bookcase, and my projector will sit on the lowest LACK shelf. I'll finish off the EXPEDIT bookcase with four of the EXPEDIT Two Drawer inserts on the bottom and four of the EXPEDIT Door inserts on the top row.

Since my DVD collection has been increasing beyond the limits of existing shelving, I'm going to be abandoning the plastic DVD cases of my DVD collection and I'll be storing my (nekkid) CDs and DVD's in special hanging sleeves that will be suspended from two sets of rails that I'll be inserting into each of the drawers. I won't be using those exact sleeves, though - too expensive for the amount that I want. Instead, I plan on buying three of these 1000 CD/DVD Aluminum CD Storage Cases. That'll give me 1500 individual hanging sleeves (that hold 2 discs per sleeve) for my entire DVD and CD collection - with room to grow. I can always use the cases to transport the collection when moving.

(click for larger image)


My shelving idea was inspired by this IKEA Hack.

Now that I think of it, the BRODER L-Feet and Post system would make a great free-standing projector screen setup for renters who can't fasten a DIY screen to the wall. One could put a LACK Shelf on the top of the L-Feet and place their Subwoofer and Center Channel speaker on the shelf to keep the center of balance low. I think I'll be doing this, as well, as I don't currently have room for my previous LCD/Plasma TV Stand for your DIY screen hack.

I love the IKEA stuff. I have the 4x4 EXPEDIT which I masacred with a circular saw to make room for my 32" LCD

Here's what I have planned for the Horizontal Folded build:



The Sketchup model can be downloaded here.

I'm liking the layout of this horizontal build much better than the vertical I had planned.

I like I like!!!

One small detail: Have you done a cardboard model of that air path? There are just a TON of turns in it. And with the smaller panels don't they build up heat faster?

Seriously though, I loev the way that looks! and if I am wrong about the smaller panels then let me know please.

My only concern with the air path is the initial "corridor" from the entrance to the LCD intake - it's only going to be 1/4" wide.
I made the entry opening 30mm (1 1/8") and I'm hoping that the smaller sized "corridor" will force the air to speed up (much like the nozzle of a garden hose). Once the air makes it past the LCD, it opens up again. I consider the curve in the air path from the LCD sled to the fan to be a rather gentle (and hopefully forgiving) curve.
I placed the fan in the front corner so that it hopefully forces more of the heat out the side.

I'm not really concerned about the heat (too much) as I had never installed any active cooling in my mini-HAAS design. I had never finished installing the controller input plate, so I had lots of cool air being sucked in from there and the actual air intake. My PCAC fan never got installed, so that's where the hot air was exiting. I never ran into a problem with the LCD overheating (the growing black spot of death) like I did when I was using my cardboard mock-up.

I have not really decided on a colour for it, yet, but I'm really liking the color that Sketchup uses for the default colour. I like the way the front of it looks with that light blue effect with the white trim. I'm not that colour-savvy, but I randomly picked the Wood_Cherry_Original for the base and I'm considering making the top cover the same colour.

I went out and picked up some more Basswood for my LCD/Fresnel cassette from Michael's, today.

I hauled all my hand tools out from my storage locker last weekend. Rooted through my toolbox and couldn't find my utility knife, so I booked down to Walmart to pick one up, tonight - picked up some more clamps, as well. I should be able to start working on my LCD cassette tomorrow morning.

Finished my first week of work at my new job last Friday and it wore me out. I'll be handling the Technical Support for a small local wireless company that creates products for the ITS (Intelligent Transportation Systems) sector. The technology is pretty cool (at least to me) and it's something I've never really noticed, until now - just on a brief tour around parts of the city, I was shown the various intersection cameras and the wireless radios (both 900 MHz and broadband) that transmit the data and video from the intersections to the city's traffic control center. If you're at all interested in ITS and want to read more about it, you can find some information here.

Good luck, Quasi! I know you can do it.

So much for the vote of confidence.
This project is being put on hold - for who knows how long.
With my new job and my lack of free time to devote to a new build, I've decided to put off rebuilding my projector. With my salary increase, it's become affordable for me to look into purchasing a 50" or so LCD TV. And to think I used to laugh at them when browsing the electronic stores.

Those 50" LED LCD TVs are looking pretty sweet to my eyes. I've been using my 22" monitor for a movie viewing platform for way too long.

If you are determined to go commercial do not go that small. Things have changed since August.

Check out the new Optima HD20 1080p FP.
Street price ~$900
3000hr normal/4000hr life in econo mode $249 bulb.
There is no better bang for the buck.

Add this anamorphic lens for ~$600, and you can go with a 2.37:1 "scope" CIH screen. (The HD20 does do CIH, some of the first reviews got this wrong.)

Add a BOC cloth screen for ~$60, or a Wilson Laminate DW for ~$160

Any option listed here will kill any 50-60in option out there 95% of the time. Guarantied.

Just noticed the Canadian location.

I think the Canadian version is an HD200x, (I think) have to check on it.

Do you have a buddy in Sweetgrass, Mt?

One of my major problems right now is that I don't currently have a large enough area to have a bookshelf (or some other type of shelf) for a projector on one wall and a screen opposite. And since I'm renting, attaching a shelving unit to the wall is out of the question. Once I've saved up enough money for a car, I can begin saving for my next home. Then I can do whatever I want. I'd really like to finish off the mini-HAAS PJ design I started way back when.

No problem, at 3.8h x 12.8w x 9.2d you could set that bad boy on top of the couch, project just over your head, and hit an 83" screen at 9ft away. 92" at 10ft. You could build a floor stand to mount it behind/above the couch... You would want a gray screen though.

No reason not to finish the DIY PJ later when you can. You can never have to many big screens.

I'm just bored. Pay no attention.

I'll be picking up a Samsung LN52B550 52" 1080p LCD HDTV from FutureShop on Wednesday. I got it for $1,499 (before taxes) - regular price of $1,799.

This should do me until I can move to a more permanent location. Sadly enough, I'll be connecting my laptop to it through VGA for a couple weeks (for DVD playback) until I'm able to pick up one of the new PS3 Slims next payday.