And so it begins - My journey into projector building.

I had been browsing lumenlab.com for a few weeks when I decided it was time to begin my own project. I haven't collected enough of the parts to form a list yet but here is the general plan so you can decide if you're interested in following the rest of this PLOG.

Specs:

- Acer 16" X163WB
- Straight-thru design
- 400W Metal Halide T15 lamp from LumenLab
- Stainless Steel bowl reflector
- Standard Lumen Lab triplet
- Extra large 220mm (Lumenlab) and 330mm fresnels (3Dlens.com)
- Sola Ballast, 400W

I hope the following will be useful to those of you who are starting out (like me) and I figure this will give me a platform through which I can ask questions and learn from other members as well. And who knows, perhaps documenting the process will be fun!!

Running $$ Total

LCD - 139.99
4x8 sheet of MDF - 20.00
T15 lumlab lamp - 49.00
S15 lens - 35.00
220mm fresnel - 25.00
AC to DC adapter - 15.00
330 oversized fresnel - 36.00
Magnetic ballast - 47.00
Odds and ends - 70.00

Current Total = $436.99

Though I had originally considered going with the 15.4", 1080 HD LCD that many people have bought on ebay and such, I honestly wasn't prepared to drop more than $200 for an LCD and controller. I don't actually have a need for a controller since all my AV stuff runs through my computer. Thus, I settled on the 16" widescreen from ACER (it's actually 15.6"). The max res. is 1366 x 768.

Stats.

Acer 163Xb

- 15.6" widscreen 16:10 ratio
- 1366 x 768
- 500:1 contrast
- 8ms

I've seen at least one or two people on the forums interested in this monitor. I've already stripped it (No issues) and considering I only paid 139.00 USD new with free shipping, this is a pretty good HD solution if you don't need anything accept a VGA.

I also own a 22" Acer monitor that I use on my main computer, I just love it so I thought this was safe.

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I won't bore you with the focal calc. stuff at this point. However, I am aware that the standard triplet with this LCD is going to result in a pretty short throw. To preview just exactly how this might look once I built it, I took the recommendation I read in a previous thread and hung a cardboard box from my ceiling to estimate placement.

As it turned out, the projector wasn't going to be in the way of my view from the living room couch. However, the picture was simply just too high for my liking. You generally want your TVs and computer screens even with your face or slightly lower so as not to cause neck strain. So, I quickly found that I was going to have to put this thing next the the couch or coffee table on some type of stand. I can't afford the pro lens at this point so that's the solution. I've measured things out and I think it will work ok.

I do recommend you try this out before you start building, it was enlightening.

I set up a lazer pointer in the rough center of my box so I could estimate exactly where my image would end up on the wall. Unfortunately, all this is kinda moot anyway because I'm moving to a new apartment in a month. But, the good news is that I've found a place and it's going to have more space, not less.

Note the lego head that is now serving as lazer-pointer-keeper-on-er.

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Stripping the monitor


Walmart had the Acer for 139.88 with free shipping to any Walmart store. I picked it up today and nervously began the process of taking it apart. For those interested, I've never done this before but I had no issues so it had to be simple. It took me less than an hour and I didn't damage anything. The cables on the inside are fairly long, and everything looks like it will work nicely. I'm leaving the anti-glare coating and whatnot on for now, I'll remove then if I'm not satisfied later on.

If you're going to buy this LCD, here's a general run-down of the strip.

1. Remove the base. There are two plastic pieces on each side on the back that will reveal some screws.

2. This will give you access to the only screw holding the back panel to the front panel: Remove it.

3. Now ever so carefully separate the front and back plastic panels with a small screw driver. Don't stick it in too far, you don't want to damage the LCD.

4. Take off the tape and undo the cables.

5. Now separate the two metal panels holding the LCD, CAREFUL!

6. Once this is done everything pretty much falls apart and you're good to go.

Pics

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You'll need two screw drivers, some patience and perhaps a beer to do the job.

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Once you're done with that, take some measurements of your LCD and it's components so you don't have to keep messing with it. Then pack it away someplace safe. A cool dry place would be good. Also, you may want to do as I did and label your box so as to deter would be pests.

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That's all for tonight. I began construction this evening but my table saw broke and it took me an hour to get it back up and running. Unfortunately that also caused me to miss-cut my last piece of wood. So, I'll be back at it tomorrow.

Nice find on your LCD monitor!
An easy-to-strip, 720p, 15.6" LCD for about $140. The only thing to make it better (other than 1080p) would be more inputs, but since you're going with an HTPC hook-up, you'll be fine.

Excellent work on making the cardboard mock-up to get a feel for the finished enclosure/throw distance - You've really done your homework!

does the display have an antiglare layer or is it glossy ?


Can you hold the LCD in front of the window or sth else and take a pic to see how good the transmitivity is ?

Thanks! I'm very excited, and I really appreciate your affirming support. I was a bit skeptical before I bought the LCD because I couldn't find anyone else who had used it. Now that I've got it apart I feel pretty good about it, and I was compelled to share that with everyone because I knew there were probably others who had at least considered this screen.

We'll see how the rest of this goes!

Maneee,


I think it does have an anti-glare coating. But I'm not touching it until I've got the projector running. I'll probably only take it off if I'm not happy with how it looks. I'm headed back to the shop (1/2 my mom's garage) to work today so I'll see if I can get a picture of its transparency today.

Ok, time for an update.

I arrived at my shop this morning with a fresh panel of MDF. This was one of the most beautiful mornings I can remember in Michigan.

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Fuzzy picture of my shop just for kicks.

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After some final measurements and some morning math I finally started cutting up my wood for the enclosure.

Inside measurements:

W = 17"
L = 31"
H = 13"


It didn't sound that big on paper. As it turns out, that's a huge box. Oops! This was somewhat intentional though. My LCD is really wide (13 15/16") and I wanted extra room to play with since this is my first build. I also want to make sure I can fit everything inside the box (ballast, power, adapters, etc...)

I included a Mountain Dew can for scale.

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For those of you new to MDF box making. Clamps like the ones in the picture below make assembly MUCH easier. Also, don't forget your own homemade Hammer of Thor (see photo).


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If you ever decide to re-build your enclosure, you could probably get the length down to 24" - 26".

Nice shop - I hope you realize how fortunate you are!

That took the better part of the morning. Once I had that done I set to building my LCD frame. And that's where the project came to a grinding halt. After two and half hours I had something functional, but it fit too tight in some places and too loose in others.

QUESTION: I'll probably post this elsewhere... but what's the best way to build an LCD frame? I've got some pics below of what I did. Though it was functional, it was too bulky and really wasn't constructed very well. I know there is a simpler and more sturdy solution. I've looked through a lot of threads and just can't find what I'm looking for.

Thoughts anyone?


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I've considered shrinking the box, focal calc. gave me a length of around 23-26 inches. But I think I'll keep the massive one for the moment. I'm not sure how big the magnetic ballasts are.

Actually, I do realize how fortunate I am. My grandpa built houses for a living and gave me all his old tools about 4 years ago, as he was getting too old to use them. I'm so blessed to have that equipment and that much space. I do my best not to take it for granted.

A few days ago I stumbled across a guy who build a CNC machine in his family room with his kids crying in the background. I'm honored not to have to share my workspace with anything or anyone but my mom's car. ;-)

At the end of the day I dumped the LCD frame I made. I need something better. I'll brainstorm on it, keep searching, and listen to what the rest of you have to say.

Maneee, I took a picture of the LCD. Hope that helps.

You should be thankful you don't have 3 brothers, and three sons, all committed to permanently borrowing yours tools (I speak from experience). My family calls it gaffling. The art of borrowing, with the full intention of returning things should you ever realize they have borrowed them.

If you live in the minneapolis area I wouldn't mind borrowing your band saw.

I imagine that would be very frustrating!! Borrow my band saw?? I think you mean, "borrow" my band saw.

I just used the frame that came with my LCD and made a simple 3/8" frame for it. Then just made the rest of my sled to fit it. Worked will and it nice and sturdy so far. ((fingers crossed)) There are some pics in my PLOG

Thanks Windcalmer, that's a little more like what I want I think. Nice, thin and simple. I've already had a look at the pics on your plog. :-)

i think you have to remove antiglare if you want good results, because it doesn't look very transmitiv.

but try it with AG, you'll see when you have first results probably you going to search for methods to improve the picture quality so firt attempt will be to strip the LCD =)

it isn't that hard as it sounds i also shyed it long long time but it was very simple...

and next thing would be that you're going to change the standard triplet to an beseler or pro triplet if you have enough money, because your LCD is very wide so you wont have bright corners with the standard triplet and you lose very much light because of the long arc 400W. so use your first case attempt and build a better one when you use bigger lens.

I'm pretty certain the picture was taken before the removal the reflective layer(s) from the LCD. This would probably account for the diffused light. Google search: site:lumenlab.com +LCD +reflective

Regarding the LCD fresnel mounts, you might want to check out this post. If you don't like that idea, try this Google search of the LL Forum for other ideas: site:lumenlab.com +LCD +mount.

i know that he hasn't removed AG until yet and that the diffuse light is because of the AG layer ...

Shout out from Plymouth (Mi), you are right about Sunday morning, man was it nice, I was camping out in Hell (Mi) and was out by the pool by 10.

Looks like you have a great start, can't wait to see what that 16"er will do.

Anti glare is not the reflective layer(s). I'm sure Quasi is talking about the mirrored layers on the back. I noticed a large difference when the AG layers was not there - noticed I didn't say removed - as its a different lcd all together ( having wounded the first) so comparing the two is like comparing a granny smith to a red delicious ( hey at least its apple top apple )

Don't touch the AG until your 100% sure you are not happy with the results, and there is also polishing the AG as an option.

Quasimojo,

I clicked all your links. You seem to be all over this forum helping everyone where ever needed! Thanks

I haven't removed a single thing from the LCD, mostly out of fear.

QUESTION: Do all LCDs come with reflector layers, AG strips AND polarizers? Looking at my panel I'm not sure what's what and I'm afraid to take anything off of it. What would be your plan of attack?

I've got a fair amount of ideas now for an LCD frame. Thanks to all of you :-) Unfortunately construction will be sparse during the next week or two because I'll be in DC and then Chicago. But I'll do what I can. This is fun!

Plymouth hu?? That's only about 2.5 hrs from me; I live in Kazoo. I love camping, it's great no matter where you are... even hell.

Ok, so I'm hearing to leave the AG alone and just remove the reflective layers on the BACK of the panel? I'm not going to do it till I'm sure but I think that's the collective opinion.

Hmmm, I missed this in my research. Assuming my fresnels are big enough, the focal lengths are correct, and the distance from the front lens to the triplet is correct, why should it matter which lens I use? I thought the issue was with the throw distance, not the brightness?

Secondly, I chose the 400W lamp out of pure ignorance. My logic was as follows: 400W = Big = Bright

Thoughts anyone?

I haven't bought either the lens or the lamp yet so I'm all ears.

problem with the 400W short arc is that you can't focus the light arc (which is ~3-4cm long) so good that all of the light gets through the triplet because the diameter is to small and next problem is if the diameter is to small the lens can't "catch" the hole LCD so the corners are going to be much darker. So bigger lens diameter is better.

Big does not nessarily mean brighter. A 150watt ceramic with a short arc, precon and pro reflector could give as much light as a 400 water i belive.

check this out I actually remember this discussion................
http://www.lumenlab.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=23684

Most LCDs that are stripped from LCD monitors and LCD TVs will have a reflective layer on the back of the panel. Again, most will have some form of anti-glare coating. If you provide some close-up pictures of your panel, we might be able to ascertain what layers yours have. An LCD with only polars on both sides will have a nice, mirror-like reflection.




- from Rajesh2007's PLOG



I know you've done your homework, John D, so you've probably seen this quote before (which is why I didn't post it before):


http://www.lumenlab.com/forums/index.php?s...st&p=272442

As far as your lamp is concerned, you can go with the LL 400W, but keep in mind that this lamp generates a lot of heat. Since you're going with a short throw anyway, you might want to consider a 150W ceramic metal halide lamp (I'm using one of these). I don't know if you'll be able to open the attachments, but here's a link to the Best Bulbs Chart thread.

maneee, not everybody has the room for a long-throw projector. And if he wants to sit further back, he can research some of the coffee table builds that have been made in the past.

Whew, ok. I had read that quote multiple times prior, but I certainly appreciate your efforts regardless. I knew the standard lens would work with a 15.4" (with larger fresnels) so I didn't think 15.6" would be that much of a stretch. Horizontally it's only 13 and 15/16 inches (so 14"). While the possibility of not being able to use the standard lens was not earth shattering, it was disconcerting.

I'll see if I can get some closeups of the LCD tonight for all of you. Some feedback on that issue would indeed be of great help to me.

If you think my brightness would be adequate with a 150W then I'm all for it. However, I'm also hoping to use the projector during daylight hours. I have super thick curtains that block, I'd say, roughly 85% of the light that enters the living room so it's still really dark. What about a 250W? Heat I'm willing to deal with for the best picture quality. However, if 400W is overkill for a 6-8 ft throw then I don't want to bother. Conversely, if my corners will be dark with a smaller lamp then I'm not too keen on that either.

I frequent your PLOG and I think the results look great so the 150W is a possibility. Unfortunately, Lumenlab gave me some weird error when I tried that attachment through your link. I'd play with it but I'm strapped for time at the moment.

Thank you again so much for your insights. All of you.

Most older Lcd's didn't have the reflective layers on the back. It's mostly been the last 2-3 years that they got popular. But most Lcd's from laptops have had them for a while now.

And I think a better descriptive term would be to say that an Lcd with only polars will be very reflective and not cloudy. An lcd with reflective layers on the back will look more like a mirror IMO.

jonjandran,

You're 15.4 1080p PLOG was really impressive to me. I read through it multiple times over the last few weeks and it's been a great source and reference for me!

Now, ill let you guys tell me what you think. The next two posts will have pics of the LCD.

Here I'll compare the front and back of the LCD

First the front

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now the back

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You can really see the difference in how they reflect the lamp and window above the table the LCD is on.

Here's the same thing, only of the corners.


Front

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back corner

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Oh, and sdubb,

Thanks for that link. I read through all of it twice. It's still all kinda floating around in my head. But I'm getting there!

Looks like Antiglare on the front and just the polar on the back.

Oh I noticed you were thinking about going with a 150w or 250w setup.

I wouldn't recommend it especially if you are going to watch in the daylight.

I would recommend a 400watt T15 style lamp with the pro reflector. It will be quite a bit brighter than a 150w or 250w.

Fair enough. I'll stick with my original plan of 400W for now. But as always I'm open to all opinions and viewpoints. :-)

Thanks


So, should I just leave those two layers on the lcd alone until I've got everything up and running?

That AG layer REALLY diffuses the light, as you can see from the reflection.

Yes leave it on for now.

Build your projector and enjoy it and then if you just can't stand it, try to remove it.

Just have an extra $180 on hand

or buy a new lcd beforehand - and strip that, if it breaks then you still have a working pj set and ready to go.

I agree with jonjandran. Looks like a clean back and anti-glare on the front.

If you're going to use the 400W lamp, the panel just might be transmissive enough to allow adequate light through for a bright image. It most likely won't be as good as a 150W'er.
If the AG bothers you, first try to polish it with Mother's Mag polish (I think it's the Mag & Aluminum Polish that people use - you might be able to find it at Walmart). If that doesn't help, you can try a strip. It's not unheard of to even have two layers of anti-glare on the front.

I don't understand that statement.

It has been proven that the 150 watt bulb puts out less than 100 lumens on the screen. Whereas a good 400 watt build with Pro reflector can put out around 200-250 lumens.

A 150 watt build will never be as bright as a 400 watt build IMO.

It most likely won't be as good with** a 150W'er.???

I don't like stating absolutes when I'm not certain. I only have experience with the 150W CMH lamp.

Thanks for your input guys. I guess I'll just have make a decision one way or the other once the time comes. I'm a little ways out from buying the lamp anyway. Who knows, I may end up trying one and then switching it out for something else.

Whew... vacations are fun, but not quite as fun when you've got a projector at home waiting to be worked on! Anyway, I'm back at it so here's an update.

Sunday I got the LCD mounted in place. I've secured that frame to the sides of the box since that's going to be the one point that isn't adjustable in this setup. The lamp, lens, reflector, and fresnels will all be able to be adjusted. Here are a few shots of that.

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