Yes, we had a glitch...sorry for the PITA.

Hi everyone! Not too much to report; we're just making parts and ordering stuff. The hardware did come in, and I added 3/8" clamping shaft collars to the hardware kit. These go on either side of the screw-receiving bloks to take any lash out of the screw.




I also got the micRo prototype pump-cooling rig running; it's going to work fine.

Hey, Ive looked everywhere for the

Z Axis Motor Mounting Bolts:
Qty 4 3mm x 45mm x .5mm pitch Allen Socket Head Bolts

I can find the other 2 lengths, but the 45mm I just can't find. I plan to buy the minimum order of the longest bolt and cut the short ones down to avoid paying for the minimum box 0f 50 for each length. But I can't find the longest one. I have followed all of the suggestions even Mcmaster-Carr. Any suggestions?

Grayson,

Is your video camera broken? It's been a while since you've last posted a video of the happenings at LumenLab. Surely you guys have something to share... even if it is just to show us how RoGR goes through its, his or her, paces.

Anyway, it will be good to see you guys again!

cheers,
Gerhard

I'm looking forward to a big announcement. Other times there's been a long period of only little updates brainchild has unveiled some new contraption or landmark. ... or maybe he's just busy.

Cool, are the hardware kits in the store yet? I couldn't find them listed.

Gordon

BC,
Will the hardware only be available as a kit, or will we be able to buy only what we need?

I don't remember hearing about the pump-cooling rig. Any further info on it?

Also I have sent several pm's about my micRo shipment to Kellie and have received no reply. I can imagine that she is tied up with orders and shipping. But, I don't know if she has gotten my messages. Or perhaps, should I send the pm's to you?

I would send Kellie an email rather than a PM on the boards. Whenever I have emailed her I have always received a response within 24 hours. Here email is support@lumenlab.com

Do you have a Fastenal nearby? Try Fastenal part# MS2510045A20000.

They only have the 45mm M3 screw in stainless steel but the good thing about buying their SS parts is that you can usually buy single quantities. If it's zinc or plain finish and a common size you usually have to buy 100. Each screw is .70 in SS but $2.80 may be better for you than buying 100 in zinc for $15 if you don't have a use for the others. Note that this isn't always clear on their website.

I was able to get all of the screws bolts and washers from Fastenal for about $16 but since not all are stock items I'd have to wait 2-3 days for them.

Gordon

We have them...



Funny, I made one last night but left my cam @ the shop. Mostly too busy/weary to do them...though I expect a whole bunch of activity once the spindles are here.



Some of both...




Not yet. Will try to get it done tonight.



Kellie is not on the boards much; she's email and web stuff mostly. I answer all PMs, though I'd say "email Kellie" if you wrote me. Sorry I forgot your cable chain...going to throw in some freebs for ya when I send it...

Spindles will ship (from China) on Monday. (They blame the mods I wanted for the delay...sigh.)

LOL, They are shipping!! That's what we should focus on!!!



cheers,
Gerhard

You wouldn't be able to provide an order list, would you? That would be amazing!

Here's what I took over there, sorry but I didn't ask if he had to change any of my part numbers and I didn't ask for the order sheet.

If you can wait until Monday I can get the final part #s when I pick them up or you can just use this as a starting point.

Note that the plastic screws were their closest substitute to the Plastite spec'd. Also I already had the set screws so I didn't order those.

Click to view attachment

I can wait, and thanks alot! I feel extremely green when it comes to all the screws. English is easy, but that doesn't mean the different names for screws are

So that's everything but the set screws? (I don't even know what set screws are )

Here's a set screw (the black thing). It's pretty much a screw that does not have a head, usually you use an allen-wrench to turn them. I guess they're used where the head of the screw would be too big or too heavy.

Some more set screws...

Note the slotted one on the bottom right.

Sweet, thanks!

QUOTE (davedavedave @ Mar 12 2009, 02:14 PM)
BC,
Will the hardware only be available as a kit, or will we be able to buy only what we need?

I don't remember hearing about the pump-cooling rig. Any further info on it?

Also I have sent several pm's about my micRo shipment to Kellie and have received no reply. I can imagine that she is tied up with orders and shipping. But, I don't know if she has gotten my messages. Or perhaps, should I send the pm's to you?



Thanks, That is much appreciated! I want to take this opportunity to tell you all what a great job you are doing. I look at my micRo and it brings back almost a year of memories...of following the progress, and the illnesses, and the baby, and the big birthday.... The ups and the downs ... It has been quite a journey! A real reality show!

Then the micRo itself! It is so well done! The feel of the parts. The whole thing exudes attention to detail and planning. I just sit and look at it sometimes... Of course untill I get the 3mm motor mount bolts, that's pretty much all I can do!

I am very happy and you should be very proud!

Have I buttered you up enough to get a handpiece holder for the Grizz? Please, please, please
I don't mean to demean what I said above. micRo is truely a wonder!

You may recognize the expression: "grub screw".


Hi Dave. I want your machine to run. I will provide what is necessary; and ask for payment when required. I'll be happy to send you a hardware kit..I imagine this will cost much less than your pain @Ace (was there again earlier...a life's endeavor...)

Vidz:

Hi folks, with the spindle nearly finished I've been trying to get the small details taken care of; naturally I'm anxious to have "my" micRo up and running when the spindles arrive. One of the details is to find/manufacture a suitable enclosure for the electrics, so I've been looking. One of my samples arrived yesterday, and both Robin and I are digging it! This is a specialty enclosure made for enclosing 'instruments', like an o'scope.

Click to view attachment

Made of steel with alum front and back. It has these cool flip-down feet:

Click to view attachment

Here I've started figuring the placement. Thats a mini-itx (17cmx17cm) with an optoisolated LPT breakout attached.

Click to view attachment

The box is big enough to enclose computer, power supplies, drivers, switches and a 7" LCD/VFD/etc...yet the box is small enough to house just the basics without being "too large". We'll offer CNC'd fronts and backs for several configurations!

Apropos mini-itx, does anyone know if those VIA mini-itx cards are suitable for running the micRo? (latency etc)

running parts video 2 is gone. video 3 is on youtube but wasn't posted here, so here ya go. that box looks pretty nice, btw.

Yay!! The vids are back!

Ooh, so due to the oxide, I can even wash the MicRo every once in a while.. just like my car!

In order to make the screws "wear" more evenly, I suppose one could move the jig. It might not weigh up against having to change the g-code for the repositioning though?

cheers,
Gerhard

BC,

I don't remember a discussion of the X-axis lead screw adjustment set screws in the gantry blocks. How does that work? The holes aren't tapped, but the pocket is there. What is the pocket for? I think I saw it being cut in a video once, but I didn't see a photo with it in use.

For that matter, the set screws are all listed in the hardware list, but none of the holes are tapped. I seem to remember that you did not think these setscrews would be needed for a while (if ever). Are they just there for the future, and we tap them if we need them? Or maybe they ae not tapped because you didn't know if we had access to english or metric setscrews?

Another micRo question. I received two motor types (see pic).



The top one has the motor leads and a short motor shaft ( 0.867") The bottom one has a 6 pin connector and a long (1.247) shaft. It looks as if the short shaft should be used for the Z axis. Is this correct? Should the long shaft motors be used for the X axis screws? Also, is there a pinout for the connector or should I use the continuity try then reverse method?

How many of each type did you receive ?

I think that the Z motor might be a different one than the X and Y. You definitely want the 2 on the X axis to match.

As for the motor pin outs, there was a discussion about that., maybe a few pages back ? Someone posted a diagram and Brain chimed in, too.

Ubuntu 8.04 only needs about 350Mhz to run so any above 500Mhz should be plenty. Obviously you should not try to do much whilst the job is running, no fancy screen-saver or 3d desktop effects. I have a Via Epia SN and a VIA VB both are 1GHz and have never had problems under linux except for 3D performance which will not be a issue for something like EMC2.

P.s check what ram your VIA takes some older models have problems with some ran chip density's. Check www.crucial.com or similar.

Thanks, Llama. I looked back and saw the discussion you mentioned. I got two of each motor so I assume, if the short shaft goes on the Z then two of the long shafts would go on the X and that would leave the other short shaft for the Y.

I still don't know about the X screw adjustment process and those 4 little pockets on the gantry blocks. Do you know?

Guess you will have to see which length motor shaft fits the X axis better, considering the motor mounts, couplers, screws and rails.

Sorry, I don't have a clue to the backlash screws/pockets.

This looks pretty good, especially with that passively cooled Via board, I've been looking in the same direction for my setup. One issue to take note of for those interested in small form factor or "embedded" boards is that power management on many of these can interfere with EMC. Many newer small form factor boards will require a pci add-on parallel port card, but by all accounts that is a good idea anyway.

For any interested, I have been testing the newer Intel Atom based mini-itx boards for use with EMC. They do seem to be a hassle, requiring a 64 bit Linux installation (The "live" EMC disk image will likely not work), and have some issues regarding the real-time kernel (the real-time kernel will not boot with on-board networking enabled), but are quite decent. These boards are available for under $100 and have all the trimmings needed, plus the above problems are expected to go away when EMC is ported to the next LTS release of Ubuntu Linux.

I am... Were you able to get the Intel D945GCLF2 onboard e-net working using a different release? I gave up in December and just installed a 3com card. I'd like to go back and do it proper.

Just to chime in on the motors. The X motors are the Long shaft ones. The Z and Y are the short shaft ones which are higher torque (longer black section).

Wiring can be figured out with a meter, a coil will have about 55 Ohm resistance, no coils have no connectivity. Basically you can test it with choosing one coil and wiring it, then on the other coil hook it up, if it moves the wrong way, switch ONE coil. I don't want to say too much on it right now. I was going to show pictures of how I have mine all setup, but I've been lazy. Now I just got back from a race and am exhausted. Hopefully you can search back in the thread and find the information you need. Or maybe BC or RW will get back with LL standardized wiring instructions.

Thanks for the chime!

In short yes, but under 8.04 it doesn't seem worth the effort as it requires a custom recompile of the kernel with appropriate modules to do the trick. Any upgrades to the system would require doing this again. The EMC crew leaves out a lot of kernel modules and this affects new hardware the most.

For the mean time I think settling with a secondary network device as you have chosen, or booting the standard kernel in order to have network access may be the most maintainable option. I may reconsider this if the EMC crew doesn't start prepping EMC for Ubuntu 9.04 around it's release on April 23rd. Does anyone want to volunteer to make and update .deb packages for EMC, rtai kernel, and dependencies?

I have to say that the more I follow this thread the more apprehensive I am about assembling my micro when I receive it. Hopefully some of those that have already received theirs will post instructions and some pics to show how to put it together properly. I would hate to put mine together incorrectly and damage one of the pieces, since I would not have the money to replace any damaged parts for a while.

Hey folks, I got the flu yesterday! It makes working uncomfortable; hope I feel better soon (and darn I'll miss my scheduled tooth-extraction/root canal tomorrow, which I need!).


Never tried it myself...



Hi Gerhard, Well I made the thing to work, so when it wears out, I'll just replace the parts that need it. Those parts are expendable.



The set screws are chamfered-type, and the bore made to allow self-tapping. We tested this thoroughly.


Long shafts on the X. While this makes sense as two motors don't need 2x torque for one axis, I'll be switching to just one type of motor for all axes in the future, to avoid this confusion.


The board in the pic is actually a core-2-duo BGA fanless. This board also runs on straight 12v. It is a specialty board for embedded applications. This board may cost about $150 nowadays. I have it leftover from R&D, else I'd be looking for cheaper stuff. I don't plan on stocking mobos since I don't care for the liability of selling a computer. Instead, we'll make it easy to implement your choice of mini-itx mobo by providing the "keys" to integration. Computers are Newegg's business!



One of the simple "secrets" of motor wiring (man this stuff reminds me of the DIY projector) is to know how to quickly identify coils. It is quite simple really: just separate all of the wires, pick one color (like red) and cross it with one other lead while spinning the motor shaft. If you have the other end of the coil, the motor becomes hard to turn. This requires a maximum of 3 steps to ascertain both coils (ie; when you have one coil, you're done).

PS, for fun, wire one motor to another, color on color. Turn one motor shaft and be amazed how perfectly the other motor shaft turns.


BWAK!




Seriously, I'm doing a photo documentary/manual of assembly this week, and I'll post it as I go in the new section for micRo manuals. Every detail will be covered, and of course I'm here to help! (even with damaged pieces.)

Thanks for the motor reassurance! I get the set screw self threading. How does the X axis adj screw thing work with that little pocket. Does the end of the set screw just push against the side of the pocket and tighten down on the lead screw by deforming the plastic against the screw? I wasn't sure because that didn't sound very LumenLab ish.

Sorry to hear about your flu/tooth thing. The tooth might be causing some of the other symptoms.

Here's what I ended up with:

Qty 8 Fastenal # 38538 (M5-0.8 x 14 HCS Z) [item cost 0.048 total cost 0.384]
{Lumenlab specified as: 5mm x 14mm x .8mm pitch Hex Cap Head Bolts}

Qty 8 Fastenal # MS2510025A20000 (M3 x 25 SHCS A-2) [item cost 0.17792 total cost 1.42336]
{Lumenlab specified as: 3mm x 25mm x .5mm pitch Allen Socket Head Bolts}

Qty 4 Fastenal # MS2510040A20000 (M3 x 40 SHCS A-2) [item cost 0.512 total cost 2.048]
{Lumenlab specified as: 3mm x 40mm x .5mm pitch Allen Socket Head Bolts}

Qty 4 Fastenal # MS2510045A20000 (M3 x 45 SHCS A-2) [item cost 0.7 total cost 2.8]
{Lumenlab specified as: 3mm x 45mm x .5mm pitch Allen Socket Head Bolts}

Qty 12 Fastenal # MS2540012A20000 (M5 x 12 SHCS A-2) [item cost 0.0885 total cost 1.062]
{Lumenlab specified as: 5mm x 12mm* x .8mm pitch Allen Socket Head Bolts}

Qty 2 Fastenal # 0142881 (10 x 5/8 PPH PTR Z) [item cost 0.104 total cost 0.208]
{Lumenlab specified as: 10-14 x 5/8″ Thread-Forming “Plastite” Screws}

Qty 10 Fastenal # 0142876 (8 x 1.25 PPH PTR Z) [item cost 0.176 total cost 1.76]
{Lumenlab specified as: 8-11 x 1-1/4″ Thread-Forming Round Shank Sharp Point}

Qty 100 Fastenal # 1140354 (5mm Flat Washer) [item cost 0.01512 total cost 1.512]
{Lumenlab specified as: Gantry Block Bearing Mount Washers:}

The machine screws are stainless just so I didn't have to order full boxes.

The screws are "thread rolling screws" the closest generic substitute for Plastite that they stocked. These are available single in zinc plated

I bought 100 of the washers in zinc since they ended up cheaper than buying the specified quantity in stainless steel.

lol, I never said I was to chicken to make the attempt, just that I was apprehensive, that has never stopped me before,lol. It is great to know that that some documentation will be posted soon.

Hope you are feeling better.

The screw pushes against the side of the thread bore. This technique has been used on leadscrew nuts for many years. Keep in mind that the adjustment is very minimal, a thou or two at most.

That's great! Thanks. I'm really surprised that the plastic is, on one hand, soft enough to deform the thread bore and, on the other hand, strong enough to support that thrust with only the 1/4" wall of the pocket to have threaded. It says a lot for the properties of the material.

Ah, I mistook the heatsink. There are a lot of embedded boards that will work for this, in a pretty big range of capabilities.
I would personally like to see if a Geode lx800-lx900 board could be appropriated for this as it fits all of the requirements plus some, is very low power, and requires no cooling to speak of. I've had a hard time finding one for a reasonable price though.

Currently the Atom boards are pretty appealing despite the setup problems. They are pretty much full featured workstations with accelerated graphics and have an on board parallel port so you can expand with a pci card to support more axes.

I'll be looking forward to this for sure.

Hmm, well, it probably says more about the intended use of the micRo. You're not going to take huge cuts in steel; we win that game with time instead. A well made machine has all of its pieces engineered to roughly the same standard, and typically "forces" failure-mode onto a piece that will fail before the rest. In the case of micRo, as was borne-out by Robin's brutal defeat on video; the couplings fail before the threads.


The only problem I have with Atom is that I've seen benchmarks showing a P4 Celeron spanking it. P4 laptop chips are really cheap and available BGA'd on some mini-itx "combo" boards for about $45 for the chip and mobo. The problems in that price range are the "SIS" and other N bridge/S bridge combos; they may not be fully supported.

BC,
Nice start on the micRo Manual! I also found that the use of wood clamps to "press" the gantry blocks onto the Y-ways was non-traumatic to both the ways and blocks. I started the ways into both blocks and spaned the assembly with two clamps and tightend them together.

I won't know until I have my micRo assembled, but rt tests on the Atom seem good, those same Celerons suffer from the latency issues inherent to the P4 architecture. so...

These boards may not work for automation very well at all due to their design, regardless of compatibility.

Thanks! A lot more to do....

Good idea with the furniture clamps. Marking the ways is critical to be certain the minimum penetration (1.125") is achieved into both gantry bloks. It still will require fine tuning up to the exact width, and that's where your clamps would be quite useful. I'll be sure to use that technique for that step.


Yep. We currently use a lot of Dell "cash register" boxes, which are P4 based and pretty slow. They work excellently for this stuff though, so I kinda lean that way when encouraging people to buy something. Please keep me abreast (this goes for anyone) if you get a board that works well. I think I'll start a thread where this data can be reported. I'm really wanting to know of a pain-free mini-itx board that I can recommend exclusively. The P4 Dells we sell are totally pain-free.

I just noticed that the text says 1.125" and the pic shows 1.25" It may be missleading to some.

I'll take that one again...

Thanks so much for the order list, gfc!