Well, we are off to the races! I have been talking over my new-found project with the wifey, and she pulls a Cortez on me ... she pulled up Ebay, saw that I was watching an auction on a 15" EIZO FlexScan L365 TFT LCD , and put the minimum bid on it and clicked okay. So I guess she wants the projector!

I had been working on my theater plans in anticipation. My master suite in this house is almost perfect I think for a home theater. While I would say normally that a bedroom cannot be a theater (albeit sometimes dramatic and theatrical), this house has a ready made area ... not just a wall.

So, here is what I have to work with. (First Attachment)

I will be experimenting with cloth/material over a mirror, and if I can get something that works well (light fusion), then I will consider building a decorative frame with a retractor/tensioner for the material. Non-theater mode ... decorative romantic mirror. Theater mode, kickin high gain screen. The backup plan is a french mount Black Flame Screen about 78" in diagonal.

The screen area (left, right) attached.

I now have a second XBox (fixed my first one last night, even though I had already bought a replacement), so maybe it is time for a modchip and XBMC. The panel has a DVI in (for my cable box) and a VGA/PC connector for my XBox (have an excellent adapter). I can hook that up with a monitor switcher also if I want to plug in my laptop.

So, build a projector, size the screen, experiment and build, figure out a good audio solution, then decorate and paint, select new recliners ... some lighting and voila. Sounds easy, huh? LOL yeah right more later

Measurements, measurements.

Well, good news! I calculate that with a throw of 156" lens to screen, I come up with about a 107" image using a 15.4" panel (guess) and the pro lens. This puts my 4:3 dimensions for a screen at about 86" x 64", which is darn well perfect for my wall. I hope I can handle the keystone issues, however. And, I will need to maintain a strong light engine output to handle the throw/size.

are you done yet? come on! hurry up!

LOL Working on the hard part today ... explaining how these things work to the wifey. Now don't get me wrong ... smart woman. She's an RN and works emergency rooms a lot. But where some people are geometry and math, she is not.

But with some diagrams of our room, walking her through the basic projector guide, and seeing SamuraiJack's PLOG (thanks, SJ!), it is smooth sailing now from an acceptance point of view.

Now for more planning. The component list.

Basic Design choice: somewhere between SJ's art deco and the round pivot qualities of Haas. The reason being, I am a tall guy (6' 3") and my kids have now passed me. I plan on hanging the pj from the 8ft ceiling, so I need some clearance. With about a 15 degree down angle, that means the most efficient form for the casing would be a diamond shape with pivot (it could get closer to the ceiling that way.

Panel: Eizo 15" VGA+DVI $100 delivered
Optics: By necessity, 15" lcd panel at 156" ... pro lens kit $199
Lamp: Value Brand VB-MH400/U + E39 mogul + M59 ballast from bulbs.com ($17+$8+$83)
(any thoughts on this choice?)
Reflector: tbd
FFC Extension: $15
Front Glass: salvage from old flatbed scanner
Fans: 2 x 120MM (Silent PC type)
12v power: Dell laptop power brick

Screen: ~107" diagonal Black Flame ... although exploring alternatives here. Going to Joann's Fabrics today to look for a material another AVS guy found. Also HD for some Do-Able recon.

Im looking forward to see your results...all the power to you in getting it done !

Hi!

Stopped in to view your project.

If your experiment with a retractable Cloth Veneer does not pan out, be sure the painted applications are "Black Flame Super Light" or RS_MaxxMudd LL.

Use a Semi-Gloss or Eggshell White Latex for the "Primer/Basecoat"

A 9" Low Nap (1/4") Roller for the "Base" and 6" Hard Foam Trim Rollers for the Top Coat.

Both coatings thinned with water to a "soupy" consistancy.

Keep me posted via AVS pm (my "Post notification" for LL hasn't worked for months.)

Just an idea, but the raised ceiling seems to me would be perfect to put the PJ enclosed in the ceiling, something like this:



Then, a regular dog coffin would work fine, and you don't have any clearance problems. I am 6'1" myself, and my PJ hanging on the 7 1/2 foot ceiling in my basement is a real headbanger. Even my wife at 5'4" has to duck.

It would raise your keystone angle a little, though. With a combination of some lense shifting and front fresnel keystoning you might be OK.

One trick that I found with mine is to always get widescreen movies, and play them on the bottom of the screen using Zoomplayer- when I do that, I am at nearly at an even level. Of course, I do have the option to change the angle to do a fullscreen if necessary with the way I mounted it.

Just some food for thought.

Thanks, Docapi! Yeah, I had been thinking about the through the bevel possibilities, but then I went exploring up in the attic. It is DAMNED hot up there. I would have to pipe in cool air from either below, or from the AC distribution, but even so ... unless I had the fans running constantly, it would require a major effort to find a way not to lose the panel in the heat. In the summer, the attic easily gets above 105*F.

My wife and I were talking it over too. The light fixture in the center of the tray ceiling is both a ceiling fan and a central light ... which is pretty glaring when its on and you are in bed. Having the PJ there actually might be kind of nice for blocking the direct bulb glare. But, who knows, if it all works well, then maybe I can build an insulated enclosure and shoot through the bevel.

One other thing is, the measurements are going to be CLOSE. If the lens is two inches past that lip, then it is 156" to the wall, and the screen will "fit" between the two doors with 8" on either side for blackout material and a sense of a border. A little higher, a little further back ... might not fit.

Thanks for the note, MM. Had something really humorous today. I looked at my wife and said, "Hey, how about we go to the fabric store and maybe look at some paint at Home Depot while we are out?" You would think I had grown a third eye! I explained to her about the different screen mixes and some of the mystery fabric from AVSForum, and she realized what I was getting at. She helped me scour Joanne's, and I think we found the fabric that makes a great screen, but unfortunately it only comes in a 44" width. I got a sample to test.

As far as heat, how about a vent placed above the PJ with some dryer hose to the intakes on the PJ? A couple of thes with some flex hose between them might work:

Supply boots

Put one over the intakes on the PJ and the other in the wall above the PJ. You could get a vent cover like this to go over the one in the wall:

Vent covers

Looking at the picture of the bevel, it looks like there is plenty of room to do so.Then you would be drawing the cooler air from your bedroom. Since the fans would not be in the room, you could use some higher CFM fans without having to worry about the noise levels.

I see what you are saying about the throw/picture size. You could have the front of the PJ extend into the room a little. Might not be quite as pretty as keeping it flush, but it would still less obtrusive than having the whole thing hanging from the ceiling.

No fan noise, no stray light problems to fight with, and you would be able to get into it easily when you get to the tweaking stage. (all things that I have to fight with with my ceiling mount)

Just brainstorming- It looks like you will have a really sweet setup however you do it. Looking forward to seeing it when it is done.

Okay, more attic exploration. The entrance to the attic is in the closet to the left of the screen. Up the attic stairs, you come out right at the raised ceiling (looking like a platform covered in insulation from that point of view) to the left. The peak of the roof runs pretty much right over it, so the support trusses come down at a tight angle on either side.

It would certainly be possible to panel in a box on the trusses I have marked. Then I could make the top hatch on a hinge with hook for "tweaking" that that would be awkward and hot as hell. Hopefully, I wouldn't have to do much with that. You can see that right above where the box would be is an AC duct going to the back side of the room. I think I could probably tap into that, run the AC duct down into my pj enclosure. The exit for the air would be the aperture to the screen. I hope that insulation plus venting would be enough to maintain temps. I don't really want to run a fan on a thermostat up there if that means it runs 12 hours a day from roof heat. Expensive energy.

The advantage also here is that I can run the cabling down into the closet, where I intend to put my AV rack. I need to investigate the IR repeater options, so that all of the gadgets can be out of the way.

I ordered my lamp hardware Friday. Value Brand 400W MH400/U, Howard HID Core and Coil Ballast (M59) and mogul. I just ran into the Pro Lens issue being out of stock! Grrrr. 9/27 is a long way away. Might have to search out other alternatives, but I do need the long throw, if I want either the ceiling mount or the attic placement.

Oh, almost forgot. I am buying an electric fireplace for the wall stage left (outside wall from entrance). Here is a link to the insert ... I will build a mantle around it. We don't really need the heat from it, just the ambience.



Should be a nice addition. The wifey bought paint yesterday for the room to match the ochre/deep tan color of the filigree in the curtains. While not a "dark" color, it should bring down the reflective light in the room. She is going to start painting today, so we shall see what it looks like on the wall. She LOVES to paint. heh.

And she does good work. The downstairs was a white wonderland. She knew I liked "coffee" themes, so she came up with a cinnamon color with coffee house accents.

She just started on the bedroom. It's a nice dark color. Should work well.

Oh, my stepson did the kitchen lighting. What a great job he did. He wants to help me put in some cans upstairs in the bedrooms as well, which will help with the master BR.

Wifey worked her buns off yesterday painting. Here are the results for the theater side.

Also, I finally put together her jewelry box (yea yea, Christmas present assembly in Sept), and then I started looking at it intently. She asked me what was so fascinating about the jewelry box, and I said, "Man, that would make an elegant projector." She made sure I kept my hands off. hehe

Well, tonight I started to work out exactly what I wanted to build as far as projectors go. I ordered my Pro lens set today, and started some calculations. Now, if only I can figure out what it takes to post in the Projector Plog section I will put my pj stuff there and my theater stuff here.

I think I am going to go with a 4 rail with positional holders approach, probably with lift off top (top, and both long sides of the dog coffin. I may make an accordion style black felt connector between the front lens sled and the rest of the projector.

Here are my calculations. Hope they are right for what I am trying to do.

Oh, and I want to build the pj so that I can merely sub out the LCD panel as later technologies and funds allow.

Does this mean you are early for Xmas '06 or late for Xmas 05???

You definately need a PJ cabinet more than she needs a jewelery cabinet, she just needs this to be explained!!!

Well, I would say late, except we moved this year, and she wanted it to stay in the box until we were really working on the bedroom, so voila!

Okay, I have been trying to work out what would be easiest for me and most flexible. Since I think I will be putting this in the attic, appearance is not quite the most important aspect. But since I want to possibly upgrade the panel someday, I want something modular.

So, perhaps this rack mount design might work.

Now it is getting exciting. My eizo 15" and my bulb/mogul/ballast are scheduled to arrive tomorrow! That means I can get going on my enclosure and lens mounts, but will have to wait 3 weeks at least for my lenses. Grrrr.

I like your plans.

Looking forward to seeing the PRO lens with a 15" panel, you should be able to capture a lot of light with that big lens. Should help you with the brightness issues.

If you can get that PJ in the ceiling, I'd say do it. One of the troubles with these PJ's is their size, if you can hide it, all the more to ya.

Good luck!

Dave

Thanks, Dave! I am having a blast with this project.

Okay, time to split threads. I am going to isolate my projector work to my project plog, and work on the master suite itself (fireplace, bar, screen, seating, lighting) will be in this thread.

Well, the projector is moving along nicely, so more HT stuff.

I priced some attic fans yesterday ... $58 each, plus I am sure there are some wiring costs too. I plan to put two up there. I did see some solar power elements for them ... that is tempting. Cool the attic without using main power.

I also started investigating the insulation and air supply for the attic box I will put the projector in. I am thinking the answer for what I need is in a duct fan. Pull A/C in when its running, drag it out of other registers when it is not, then find a way to vent the hot air out to the attic without letting it back in. More thinkin' time needed here.

great project...I am anxiously planning my own HT now.

Question for you... Could you give some of the dimensions that you are using as far asPJ locating goes...

1. The distance from the screen to the triplet

2. The dstance from the triptlet to the ceiling.

I ask becasue when I do these calculations I never come up with numbers that will work for a PJ mounted close to the ceiling. The keystone angles always come out huge...way more than the 15 degree maximum that I have read about. I am trying to get a finiished screen diagonal of around 120", or 8' width. Unless I am calculating incorrectly.

Well, my projector is about 2/3 finished now, so believe me, some of this is still "theory" and calculation.

I plan on putting the triplet about 9.5 ft up and about 13 ft across from the screen wall. I figure with my rig I should get about a 105" diagonal screen area (84" x 63"). I think it will be set up with the center of the screen 4.5 ft above the floor, which means if is 5 ft below the triplet, which makes the distance from the triplet to the center of the screen just shy of 14 ft. Hmm might mean my image is larger than I anticipate, but too hard to judge ahead of time. I think that makes my offset about 20 degrees, so a challenge.

Yeah I calculate just over 21 degrees. The same problem I am having. Does anyone know really how much above or below the center of the screen you can place the triplet using the "lens shifting" idea and then keystoning?

I am going to follow your thread since i want to accomplish the same thing with a 15" panel and the pro lens kit

Yep, fret ... we are gonna find out, eh? LOL

So, the electrician stepson, while very good with wiring is not so good with balance and protection. And if youngest stepson wasn't out hunting with the digital camera along with him, I would have pictures. Heheh

Seems while he was trying to install of the attic fans, one of the boards he was leaning against twisted, sending he and his ladder plummeting into the ceiling from the attic side. He was able to hang on (twisting his arm painfully), but his feet punched right through the bedroom ceiling.

And, unluckily, not where I wanted to cut anyway. So, time for some drywall repair.

Tonight I am fired up. I could almost sound like Elken!

I stepped away from tweaking on the projector, and worked a bit more on my HTPC. A trip to Best Buy, and I am now the proud owner of the new ATI HD TV Wonder 650. VERY nice board.

I dropped it in, loaded up the drivers, rebooted and voila! My cable box output now appears on my screen. Not only that, it cleans it up and does motion handling on it. Even on and SD signal.

I just watched DOOM at 4:3 from On Demand, and it looked GREAT. Not a bad movie ... I might have liked it more, because I didnt expect too much from it.

I also stopped by Lowe's and prowled around the paneling. No joy on a sheet of Parkland, dagnabit. But, I did see a nice Matte White sheet of Formica. It is 4x8, so would only work for a 16x9 screen, but tempting.

I think I want a solution that let's me go with the 4:3 ratio in about a 7.5ft x 5.5ft size. Still on the hunt.

Well, the projector is going through a metamorphosis to fit the realities of the room.

In order to get the size small enough for the room and the area between the two doors, it needs to be just a bit too far inward from the edge of the tray ceiling. I cannot put it in the attic and maintain WAF.

So, the enclosure is being re-crafted to a 14.5"x13"x36" (or so) long rectangular shape. I will probably taper both ends also as I get my electronics embedded. This will let me hang the pj from the ceiling joist just outside the tray ceiling, but where about 1.5' of the pj will extend into the open space past the tray.

I will color coordinate the enclosure with the columns and the walls nearby, and it should hang and pivot similar to a performing arts light. One step at a time....

Harooom!

The projector is now smaller, but the angle of the backend might still crash it into the ceiling if I put it high enough so the front-end clears the heads of tall people. It's going to be close.

Of course ... now it might not look so bad coming in through the tray. Wishy Washy my name.

Now for more of the HT electronics work.

I want to test Beyond TV 4.4 with the ATI 650 card and DVD playback. If that works, then I think I might have a viable solution to the suckiness of Catalyst Media Center. A free firefly remote would come with that as well, though the Beyond TV/Media combo would be $99.

While the projector waits on some replacement parts and finishing touches, I may download the trial versions of those tonight. I can try and work them with the ATI Remote Wonder. I also may try using NetRemote with WiFi to drive the HTPC. I will use a monitor for now, though, until the pj is back functional.

FYI: I've had that remote for a long time (Firefly) and love it to death. It's just very
simple and always works... have yet to miss a button press.

Excellent news! I just downloaded the Beyond TV 4.4, and I think I am really going to like it. It seems very easy to use, and the reception/image is terrific with the ATI 650.

I played around with GraphEdit a bit today as well. I noticed that when I play a DVD while not using the Catalyst software, it doesn't seem to be referencing the hardware decoding on the ATI TV Wonder 650. I am going to have to look into that.

So ... Firefly driving Beyond TV sounds like a plan. Now I need to try out the Beyond Media to see if it meets my need for DVD playback. I really would like it all to be tightly integrated. I just hope this old Pentium III clunker I am running on can keep up. So far so good though.

I tried NetRemote Pro last night. It is an interesting concept, but I found no quick and easy setup for BeyondTV, which is disappointing. I am pretty sure with Girder and NetRemote Pro, I could have something pretty substantial, but that seems like a lot of work. Though, it is definitely a DIY project for a programmer type like me.

Beyond TV, ATI TV Wonder 650 and a Firefly Remote seem pretty good so far. I need to pick up a serial cable today to drive the cable box (assuming Charter hasn't hamstrung that). The Logitech Z-680's seem to be holding up well as my audio, though I am a bit concerned about the remote control of those. Not a lot of discrete codes there.

I think I am going to experiment soon with driving the projector with the PC through the DVI port and the XBox to the VGA port with the X2VGA. The switching between inputs concerns me a bit, since the panel I use has no remote. Might end up having to go with a remote controlled VGA switcher.

I got a serial cable for the Motorola cable box, and by jolly golly it works.

So, now at least I have SD quality programming with no encryption going into my HTPC, and the HTPC can handle all the tuning and channel-changing of the cable box. I can now DVR all the movie channels, etc., so content should not be an issue. Handling the Charter On-Demand stuff might be a little trickier, though. Oh well, one step at a time.

Upside: My ATI remote is now better programmed to work with Beyond TV, and for now I have it playing on a 32" TV while I await parts to finish the projector.

Downside: When you click over to the program guide of Beyond TV, there doesn't appear to be a way to just show movies, like you would on a cable remote. Strange oversight, don't you think?

Sweet! I have my FTR-9964 in hand now. I plugged it in briefly today before I had to leave out of town. It seems to work very well as a tuner/transcoder/scaler. I will need to do a lot of gamma/color work, though. I had spent a good deal of time tuning the HTPC, so I am sure it will take some here as well.

But, at least the cable box works great. I am ready now to try the XBox when I get home.

Well, back from funeral and thanksgiving.

I hooked up the XBox last night ... used the s-video connection into the E-Box, and that worked well. Maybe later I will raid the downstairs XBox for it's HD connection, but this seems to work well.

I haven't figured out how to easily and quickly switch from TV to XBox and back again, but that will come with more fiddling. My Philips universal remote seems to work well with the e-box so far, but I guess I am not sure what I am missing out on. The zoom and stuff on the e-box is not intuitive, so I am going to track down a manual on-line.

Still, it is nice to have cable and dvd's now looking pretty good and without an HTPC in the way. Now if I could just get my brightness and hue where I like it.

Edit: Just ordered a replacement remote for the FTR-9964 which uses model RC2035 remote. $30 delivered from an EBay buyitnow. That should help me get things tuned up alright.

Sweet Beejeebeez! I am fired up at my image now!

I *think* have the video part of my FTR-9964 Philips E-Box rocking pretty hard now. The picture is brighter than with the HTPC, the composite image being run through the digital noise reduction of the E-box is making for an almost HD-quality, and the remote works! The Philips Matchline III remote (2035/01B) appears to be doing the trick well for driving the E-box and the cable set-top box. I can't seem to get it to drive the Logitech speakers yet, but that will come. I am also going to need it to drive the XBox.

But, now that I know that I know that the electronics are acting the way I want, I can polish up the pj, mount it in the ceiling, then split my time on the IR Blaster setup and closet AV Rack and finally, the screen.

The screen choice for me is still not clear. First is the substrate. I need about 7.5' x 5.5', which is larger than most "easy" choices as Lowes/HD. I think I may have to fabricate a peg board backing on a wooden truss skeleton first, then maybe stretch some sort of fabric over that. I don't think BOC is an option at that size. Possibly I can use that muslin sheet my wife bought, then paint over it.

When I begin mounting the pj, screen, rack, etc. I will catch up on pics.

Since your very happy with the picture and brightness level that your pj is putting out ,I won't cut myself short and go with a DIY screen ,DaLite is the way to go you could probaly go with a 1.5 or a 1.1 gain screen and it will only make your picture brighter.
You can get one on ebay for no more than $170 that should include shipping,ok now that's out of the way where's the "PICTURES" I've been waiting to see your results.

RR

Wife has hid the camera somewhere!

Found the camera! Now, the room is still under construction, so nothing to report there, but here is the image I am getting from standard digital cable on movie channels. Perhaps just a hint of too much red in the pics, but it doesn't show like that in real life.

Those pics look great,did you have to ajust your camera and what are you projecting on oh yea please show some more.

RR

400 ISO, +.3 on the exposure, 10 sec delay with the camera sitting on top of the projector. (Makes for a steady shot). I find that at 400/+.3 it best shows what the user is seeing.

Still the tan sheet.

Woot! Got my Behr Ultra Pure White screen painted on my wall.

Reasons to go with straight UPW
1) Great wide angle viewing
2) Cheap and easy
3) The bright white makes for accurate colors and solid 1.0 gain for low light projectors

I merely taped off a perfect square on the wall, then rolled on the paint. I have one more coat to do later, but my expert painter wife wants to do the final coat.

I decided not to go with any metallic or RGB additives or a poly topcoat. This allows the white to blend better with the molding and doors nearby.

I also picked up the Leapfrog IR repeater, which allows me to now have everything but the speakers in the nearby closet.

The projector has been an absolute hit with my XBox lovin sons here for for Christmas. Each quadrant of a multiplayer game is a 50" plus diagonal.

I just recently made a screen by buying hardwood and painting it with coats of ceiling flat white paint, silver metallic, pearlessent paint, and polyacrylic. It worked really well. I actually got a zoombox for christmas and it looks SOOO much better w/ the screen...

Nice Work!

Weldonjb,

I was thinking about the an IR repeater system, can you explain what you did with the Leapfrog a bit more.

Also - I like the UPW. Our basecoat under the MM looked great, but I have to say the MM improved it nicely, especially the corners and the viewing cone. The color would be off from your molding and doors though..... it has more of a grey color. We have the same doors / molding / color in our basement and the MM is different....

bah ... nm ... figured it out

Swill, I realized I never addressed your question. The repeater is called Leapfrog. It lets me put the IR eye back by the bed when my wife wants to watch TV there, and all the equipment is in the closet. It translates the IR signal to radio, then picks up up, retranslates and changes the channel, etc.

That said, we are prototyping a new setup in the Mastersuite Theatre. I have put the pj where the screen is, and I have put up a temporary sheet-screen just in front of the bed. We are testing whether we like the screen closer to the bed (both sides visible), and if so, we can put the pj behind the wall in the bathroom.

Then, if I get ceiling speakers, a retractable screen (translucent for both sides viewing), and wire both sides of the bed for headphones, when no one is watching TV ... it's invisible (mostly). This plan is going to get me laid, the wife says. LOL

Well, my prototype screen stayed up for a little bit, then plummeted, but it was long enough to get an idea of how it would be.

I am exploring now what the room would look like with a vertical build that pivots. Maybe take the PopUpVideo design and put wheels on the bottom so it can turn to face the bed. Then install a PopUpScreen between the mattress and the sleigh bed foot.

The PopUpScreen would basicall be two rods on pivot points down around the mattress level hidden behind the wood of the bed (WAF+). You would then just lift up both sides and click into place, and the screen would be stretched between the two poles. Issues of wrinkles come to mind, but it doesn't have to be perfect in this configuration.

The challenge then with the room design is to make it so the image is not reversed when you see it on the front wall or through the rear projection material when in bed. Gonna have to think on that geometry.

-nice to see i'm not the only one thinking, in more than one room projections, from a single PJ.
On the geometri side - if you turn your PJ around to the bed (rear projection), it should be flipped horisontaly.

thanks for "pfft Just sing "It's my plog and I'll plane if I want to!" nice one.

Well, I took the plunge. I have done my time as a tinkerer of aluminum, MDF and optics. I blew out my circuit board on my 10.6" panel, and the wife said "Oh thank god!" ... and then insisted I go buy a small, attractive PJ. I can make a GREAT image, but my enclosures suck wind.

So, this morning I ordered a brand spanking new Mitsubishi HC4900 (1920x1080) HD unit. This should ROCK! Oh, and for those interested, I got it for $1895 from the Projector Place (no tax) and until the end of the month, there is a $500 rebate from Mitsubishi. So ... 1080p for #1395 ... gotta like it. And great reviews and specs.

Now I get to finally focus on the HT aspect rather than the PJ aspect. Gotta mount the sucka, run some wires from my rack to the spot, mount the 5.1 speaker system and cook the popcorn! Course it never ends there right? I will need to put dimmers on the lights, maybe put some light cans in the ceiling, put a nice felt edge around a reworked 16:9 screen area, etc etc.

Good choice buying the IR repeater. I decided to make one and although it only cost me 25 dollars, I am an EE major and I had to get some help with the head of the department for a few hours to get this thing working Nice to see the progress!

Yes, that IR repeater has really worked well. I am definitely going to get it mounted above the screen, though. And I am going to make sure whatever Universal Remote I end up with has a long range. My wife likes to flick channels from the bed.