The transfer function is the same. Increase the cap = more power.

You don't need to change the cap any how, your auto transformer has a top voltage higher than the line right?

ok here is a difference between 150 watt and 400 watt

the measure is in watts of power

400 watt 26.2
150 watt 21.2 without precon 18.1 EDIT>>>>>>>>>>>>>heheheh change that to 22.3 now

centre screen

also when I fired the HQI,, i expected it to be brighter than all before,, well it was not... hmmmm

and also the supreme focus I have grown used to, had disappeared too,,

another thing after I saw the HQI run,, and came face to face with all the temps.. nah forget it... oh damm I just realised my heat shield is still in place,,, heheheheheh remeasure grrrrrrrr

Can someone ask Elken; "Will he do some lux measurements with Philips CDM bulb too ?"

Thanks for anybody, who asks him...

elken, as your are prone to do experiments, could i suggest you to try another sort of reflector ?

This is a "half pipe" DIY type reflector that should be placed a few millimeters away from the bulb. You see the thing ? Normally the shape should be exactly a half-pipe, but you can try to go a bit parabolic if you want

It is easy to make with some shiny aluminium sheet (very thin you can cut this with cissors) available for cheap in some hardware stores. This aluminium withstand the heat without any problem.

I've experimented this on my project with quite good results (very sharp picture). It's called a "pimalator" (by the name of a french forum member on www.allinbox.com ...)

The KEY thing for this type of reflector is to find the best shape that will give the higher luxies in the corners, and gather as much light as possible ... For a 150W light engine, efficiency is very important, so ...

PS: You can also use it with a precon, no problem at all.

Here are some pics :

Hi Elken,

I have a simple question about the 150-watt bulbs you are testing...

Have you had any precondensors crack from the heat, or are these 150-watt bulbs just not hot enough to damage the lens?

ummm hehe the lamp is well past testing,, she be in full flight,, and no,, there is no heat problem, i had one lens crack but it was a double convex flint,, which cant take any heat at all...

Elken has taken lux measurements and sent them via PM to me.
With his permission I am posting them.

The magic numbers are

36 24 36

I Have seen the light....


LET THERE BE LIGHT !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Click to view attachment

How I felt with HQI again hehehehhehe

How did you know she be a Blonde,,,, mmmmmm

and back to the 150 watt


Click to view attachment

paladin, what was the size of the screen. lux mean nothing without size of screen

I think it was a joke, 36-24-36 is the measurements for "the perfect woman."

LOL, i'm so stupid sometimes, you got me Now that i look at those numbers they mean something....

At least, i know the perfect woman has 66% vignetting now !

I Got 92 60 92,,, much bigger figure

Elken, are you seeing my wife?

nah someone else's heheheheh


heheh but thats after she had fired him too,,, of course !!

@elken "I Got 92 60 92,,, much bigger figure"

Hey thats sound like my 'polar bear'........ < hidden msg within

You wouldn't of happened to have seen her recently ??

Sorry, no. Hibernating perhaps?

Thanks Elken.

Did you measure both using the same reflector/precon ? (I assume the 18.1 is without precon and the 26.2/22.3 are measurements with ?) That's pretty impressive... only about 15% loss... I assume that you reflector/precon arrangement is the one you took from the 35mm slide projector ? This is very good news... and and improvement over Meyer2's results as he was comparing the two lamps using the same reflector and precondenser as setup for the HQI arrangement with about a 50% drop. Of course both lamps, when optimzied, will likely have a different reflector/precon arrangement due to the difference in arc lengths (~30mm vs. 10mm).


Different lamps certainly effects focus... I witnessed this switching between multiple lamps such as the EYE BT28, Ushio PS, Ushio S400DD, PlusRite 6500K (aka mikeyd's lamp) and Osram 400W HQI... I believe your earlier observation about the arc chamber shape effecting focus... acting as a sort of cylindrical lens... this was apparent for me in using the PlusRite lamp and going from horizontal to verital (lamp to panel orientation)... the vertical was brighter and had better focus. I had originally thought is was the arc length too, but after you made that observation, I think I agree with you... any thoughts on that ??

cheers,
gs

was this the 150W hooked to your 400W ballast ! ... or maybe the 70W (1mm arc) beauty on a 400W ballast... I think Australia is the only place on earth you can "get away" with detonating an atomic weapon without anyone noticing for years.... (yes, this is a true story for people who haven't ever heard of it...)

Eye now list a 250 watt 15mm arc ceramic.

http://www.eyelighting.com/tb/MH/CeraArc/E...52-78-55108.pdf

Yea, they've had that there for some time now, however I haven't seen a place actually selling them. I first saw this back in early august or so... I was speculating about a 400W versions arc length as there are no spec sheets available for it on-line... another thing I am concerned about is the spectral match of the EYE's to the philips... seems to be more blue and green in these eye's than the philips has in their ceramic lamps... only testing will say one way or another...

cheers,
gs

There does seem to be a small difference...





(comparison of the spectrums from each lamp after passing through typical lcd colour filters)

hey... now how did you get those graphs ! ... are you holding out on us ?? Would you mind explaining more about your setup and testing these lamps ? ... and where on earth did you get the 250W EYE lamp ? Would you mind explaining the "y" axis in this chart ? Thanks !

Also, can you do this test using an incandescent lamp ? ... should give us a pretty good plot of the color filters (without the "jaggies" coming from a MH source)... if you can post the make/model of your LCD too...

Lol, sorry for the confusion, I am just using manufacturer specs

using datathief to extract numbers from graphs
then excel to multiply bulb spectral output values by lcd colour filter transmissivities

example of CDM and LCD filter values before crunching:



Yes I can do the same thing for incandescent, white leds, xenon, you name it ... Just need a (semi decent) graph of the lamps spectral distribution

Actually, I think she was about 4' tall with MMUD like skin and a red glowing eye.

Yes elken, please explain your earlier observation on the vertical arc to panel orientation. I'm very, very curious myself.

arrhhhhh,, tanx for reminding me,,, I forgot to do another vertical to panel test with cross hatch pattern, with the modified lens

Dont know if anyone has come across this idea before, but I'll post it here as its Elkens fault for getting me interested in this stuff

http://www.freepatentsonline.com/5737045.p...653930ddac6c0ea

The patent discusses adding a notch filter between the lamp and LCD to cut out unwanted color spikes (such as blue/green and red/green)

There is some good info in there for the curious

heheheheh gee tanx,, tis ok,, my fault,,

here is a sampler

Click to view attachment

close up

Click to view attachment

Two std shots,, altho I ma not happy how they came out,, but anyways

what it shows is all the light background clouds etc are not lost in oversaturation, while shadow details are not hidden either

hmm space

Hey, just wonderiing...... are those last shots off a dvd ie. 480p source ..... im guessing so, but that is just mind blowingly sharp

Check ur PM's grasshoppwer

Oh, and can we get an ETA on pics of the new and improved setup/box/all of above + more,,, lookimg forward to those !

Are those recent pictures using the 150W Ceramics or the 400W?

I’ve just returned from elken’s bunker, 3.5 hr train trip Grrr. It was just a flying visit so we didn’t have much time to do any real nitty gritty tests. And before anyone asks, No I didn’t bring along my lux meter, oops .
Here’s a quick comparison between elken’s 150W osram+ reflector+pre-con and my HQI with no reflector and no pre-con, my screen size is 120" diag.
Click to view attachment
Click to view attachment
DJ

Daz - you seem to have some vertical "banding" in your image. Any idea?

And why no reflector/precondenser?

Dazz,, I had to check that hue of yellow that was on my bottom image youtook last night,,, cause it looks kak !!

anyhow I figured why it was like that,, I tried different mirrors, and that new stripped one has a distinct yellow cast to it,,, hmmmm must have overdone the strip, in haste,, using a better mirror now equals your shot of HQI at your place..

I again tried the LL FS,,, no luck backwwards or forwards, just wont allow focus to happen,,, wiiieeeerrrdd,, still pondering on this one.. but it has good colour transfer tho..

another point is with a perfect mirror, you can see that the triplet is showing astig error,,, inside focus a circle dot blooms downwards, outside focus it blooms to the right,,,, a 90 degree shift,, which is what astigmatic error does...

the more we get these things finely tuned, more things show up that were previously hidden,, this error is not visible from normal viewing position tho, so not a real headache,, only for us padantic fools who chase perfection hehehhehe

elken, are you intersted in testing the "reflector" i was talking about earlier ?

OGO,, sorry I must have missed it,, or forgotten,,, which reflector..

ahhh cylinder one ,, have not seen anything like that here in aus...

Hello dajyn,
I’m not sure what you mean. Can you add an arrow or something?

The reason I didn’t use a reflector or pre-con is because I’ve been running some other tests an simply haven’t put the pre-con back in yet and I haven’t had a reflector in this projector yet, slack I know.

Hopefully tomorrow I should be able to take a couple more pics using a hci, same as elken's

DJ

It's great to see some comparison shots, the HQI has some nice colours but the sharpness seems miles away from the powerball? Just look at that detail!

Thanks guys for your work, fingers crossed it's just the mirror giving the yellow tinge.

Are both shots taken with similar camera settings? can't view exif info at the mo.

Any opinions Daz of the powerball image?

I wonder... is it possible to get even better colours?



Yummy

Dazzz, I think he's referring to the picture of Elken's projection and the vertical lines running through the face. I would guess these are caused by the camera. I know sometimes I get them when taking screen shots. Perhaps if you labeled the photo's in your post to avoid confusion. (top on is Dazzz, bottom one is Elken... according to the file names anyway).
Some interesting things... first is exposure time... both photo's at ISO 200, f/2.8, but your photo is .49s exposure and elken is .27s ... now we could say that elken's projection is brighter, but it looks like his picture is also underexposed slightly. (this is likely the cause of the blacks blending together in the b/w gradient just above the yellow flowers in her hair). Also there is a lack of the background color in the area just above her head in elkens projection... again likely caused by underexposure. Incorrect exposure can lead to off colors, and may also be the thing causing the 'vertical banding' mentioned before. I would also have the white balance set to the same fixed value... having auto white balance allows the camera to change depending on the color of the lamp and doesn't give a good color comparison between two shots. Dazzz.. perhaps you can check the camera to see what white balance settings were for the two shots ? (EXIF only shows 'auto', it doesn't show the actual setting the camera used) I would use the 'daylight' setting for comparison purposes. My guess is that a difference in white balance may be the cause of the "overall" color difference between the two photos. (although from previous shots the CDM always seems a bit on the red side, which is consistant with the photos) ... all this aside from the fact you said your mirror was giving you a yellow hue...

The focus in Elken's projection is pretty consistant over the whole projection although not as sharp as the focus in the upper left hand corner of Dazzz's projection. This could likely be a bit caused by an error in focusing the PJ, or a misfocus of the camera when taking the picture. In Dazzz's projection the lower portion is soft, and the lower right hand corner is a total blur, while the upper left is sharp and crisp... not sure if this is just the camera, at f/2.8 I would say this is likely the true focus of the image at the time... perhaps you could comment ? Were you using a modified pro triplet ?

To Elken's point... the detail he is exhibiting in the photo of his projection is very nice. I will call to attention the 'thing' around her neck. Elken's looks very "real" and 3 dimensional with the color showing between the metal loop 'things' (ha ha ... don't know what to call this stuff), and the fringe on the bottom (and top for that matter) looks excellent. Some of this difference is due to focus so it is hard to accurately compare. Also the neck line of her dress... elken's certainly shows great skin tone and a 3-D look to it. I would have like to seen pictures of Elken's projection with exposures at 1/3, 1/2.5, 1/2 and 1/1.5s too see what the longer exposure would have done to the image.

Dazzz, you posted the two pics, but didn't say much in the way of your overall experience. What did you think of elken's setup vs. your own. I've tried to pull some info from the photo's but it's very difficult to judge from photo's... there are too many variables that can change, especially with point-and-shoot type cameras... which reminds me, what is your camera model ? (several choices from EXIF data).

cheers,
gs

Perhaps you can fill in some information about what this spectrum is from !

cheers,
gs

Overall I was impressed with its performance, very viewable with ambient light. It’s difficult to judge how it compares to the hqi when they are both in different environments but one thing that was notable was its ability to show detail in dark screens. Elken played some of Starwars III, in particular the screen where Anakin was in the bed with satin sheets. When I played the scene again with the HQI the detail had vanished. It’s hard to quantify, while the HQI projected light sections, like the Anakin’s metallic arm brighter than the ceramic, the ceramic showed more details of the dark sleave around it. I was only there for a couple of hours and in that time we had to eat.

DJ

GS seems to explain it - "banding" = lines in face, perhaps from digital camera.

The bottom pic is definitely much brighter and more pleasing. But it sounds like Daz's top pic was taken without reflector or condenser and with a screen diag twice as big, which means 4 times the area or 1/4 the lux compared to if he shrank it down to elken's screen size - (or did i miss something along the way?...)

Sounds like you guys are on the same coastline...otherwise it would take a lot more than 3 hours of train ride between. Great dedication by Dazz. I've read Australia is as big as the continental U.S. Difficult to imagine a place that huge with so few people (in comparison)...oh, I forgot about Canada, my neighbor.

The photos were only hand-held, quick and dirty and my camera isn’t anything fancy, point and shoot . I would have loved to stay longer but as it was we I already missed one train so it was a mad dash to catch the last one. Tomorrow I should be getting a HCI so I can do some more comparisons.

DJ

I actually took my family to the royal Melbourne show for the day. So Elken’s visit was only if we had enough time. From hear to Melbourne is about 2 hrs them from central Melbourne to Elken’s are another 1hr. By the time we got to Elken’s house we had been away from home for about 10 hours already, total journey time was 16 hrs.

DJ

edit:
Oh and 3 children full of sugary stuff (child accelerant).