hehehe, read this kinda fast and for some reason the word "where" fitted itself somewhere in there...hehehe

BTW, is this DAZZ's? Just want to be sure it has been calibrated too.

And remember no lights on at all around the house. It has to be dark dark dark.

so tell us, can you get the same crisp whites with the Powerstar as you used to get with the Philips CDM ?

thanks

Elken, I just realize your not using the aspheric lens/plano convex combo you showed earlier, I'm curious if this worked by any chance.

I have not tried it yet, those were just the parts pulled out of an old 35mm slide PJ,,

At the moment because of PRO FL change, I am doing maths on all the optics, as I need to recalc all the optical positions for precons fressies etc

oh PS the Pro Trip, now is a 535mm FL lens, by reverse calcs and measures thats with a 3.5mm spacer instead of the orig 12.5mm

its funny the CDM would have fitted in that housing perfectly too

CDM?
What's that?
Anyways keep, on keepin on.
Your doing more to destroy my marriage, then I could do.
Grats with that.
Just keep telling me what I need to buy. (that the wife will object to).
Good work boss......

ok for the gamers,, here are some XBOX 360's

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sorry about frocus,, done to hasty

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how do you like this chunk of stainless,, absolutely mirror surface,, mmmm

my son playing XBOX, notice lamp on there too.. all shots taken with running plus kitchen lights too

I don't mean to interupt this thread, but these guys sell RX7s lamp holders.


http://www.solded.com/boutique/product_inf...amp;language=en

I see a lot of good work and progress happening...

Here's a thought - if it hasn't been suggested already:

Once a light engine "design" or configuration is found that seems to offer the best performance/value, then perhaps it could be "kitted" or pre-built for others to drop into their projectors without too much grief or effort.

I would envision it being made out of metal, due to the heat issues. If someone works in a metal shop or knows someone who does, then perhaps the parts could be laser-cut out of galvanized or stainless steel, or even plain steel and painted.

There could even be different sizes/versions for different lamps. I see that elken and SIM have made a lot of progress towards optimizing/perfecting their designs. Has anyone else gotten close also?

And then there's the new LL pre-built PJ's. They obviously have an efficient/powerful light engine inside them, optimized for a smaller LCD panel. But it could likely be made to work with larger panels also, simply by using a longer FL fresnel. Perhaps LL can get the PJ-maker to offer their light engine parts for sale?...

Edit: Once specific components are settle on, I could perhaps design the light engine "box" or support structure. I can even get low quantities of flat metal parts precisely laser-cut. These could fit together with tabs and slots and be held together with small screws/brackets, etc.

Because the parts would be made for my "personal" use - in our product development lab at work - I'm pretty sure I can't sell them or make any profit from them. Maybe a barter system perhaps. Or maybe a place could be found to make the parts once a design is finalized.

now wot u gunnado wiff tha stainless ?

Hi elken,

Any chance you could measure the voltage and current across your G12 powerball.

I'm using a 150W eballast and getting 106V, 1.5A. I'm wondering if I should switch to a magnetic ballast to get a higher current so it runs closer to spec.

sounds on spec,, you could try it,, also the mag ballast has a 220v input which would allow within spec overdrive too,,

ok here are three shots,,
first standard CDM with std lens
second prolens modified with ball ceramic
third is the $4,000 sony commercial PJ

I thought I should be seeing 1.8A across the lamp not 1.5A

sony

106 volts multiplied by 1,5 amps is 159 watts
the lamp is 96 volter, at its spec of 1.82 amps is 174.72 watts

so it's not far off mark..

Uncle Elken , what is your test picture address ? Could you post it please... Btw, Powerball results look better now, I mean whites are better than first results. And also blacks are really better than CDM (+std. lens)...

Edit: LOL looks like he doesn't care about my questions. Hahahaha... You're the man Elkin, you're the "Elkenicism" lol, you're the sublime, you're the Aladdin's lamp lol, and you're the card-carrying member of this forum lol. Go Elkein, go... lol

yeah, but from my understanding it is the current that controls the brightness and colour so I would like to get closer to 1.8A if I can. Any chance you can stick a clamp meter around one if those wires?

elken - nice photos Your results are typical of what I've seen in commercial PJ's. To my eyes your DIY actually produces a better picture. It seems to have more depth in your photos - almost like there is a haze across the Sony image, which looks "flat" to my eyes and not very 3-dimensional.

Do your own eyes agree with that assessment in real life?

What model Sony projector? And what model LCD panel in your projector?

(Sorry, I'm sure you've mentioned this information before elsewhere.)

Do you have more comparison shots?

Thanks!

Edit: I found part of my answer in elken's thread. The Sony VPL-PX1 is a very old data presentation PJ (1999) - not a home theater projector. They don't give constrast ratio, but it's probably pretty poor. No wonder the image doesn't hold up to a good DIY setup.

http://www.projectorcentral.com/Sony-VPL-PX1.htm

ok here is link to very closeups of screen,, these were done to highlight the PRO lens mod,, but also are relavant to Ceramic setup too....

http://www.lumenlab.com/forums/index.php?s...id=169246&#

she is at 1.9 amps currently,, by clamp test..

Thanks elken
magnetic ballast.. looks like the way to go.. for now..
now I've got to find that post where you listed the mag specs...

Elken, these latest shots using the moded pro lens are really amazing. Especially when compared to the Sony. I would imagine in real life the differance would be even more apparent.

Congratulations! on the great work you've done in this area.

Are lux measurements likely to follo.........Sorry I won't go there.

Elkin,

I am thinking of getting an ice cap 250W e-ballast to overdrive a CDM 150/SA/942 bulb.

The Icecap is: 250-MH / 120V
it states: Lamp Voltage: 130V, and Lamp Current: 2.1A

Is your setup overdriven? Do I need to overdrive it or should I just get a 150W ballast?

Thanks, your research is a real help!

I just ruined a $300 CDM lamp by driving it with a 120-175W electronic ballast which delivered 130volts to the lamp. I am inclined to suggest that your 130V 2.1Amp, 250W ballast will ruin the bulb.

Thanks, I am curious, what are some good ballast to use for the CDM lamp. I remember elkin saying earlier that the bulb needed 1.8 amps. Most of the 150 volt ballast I have found operate at 1.6 amps. Also, on the note of ballast, I am concerned about ballast noise. Do I need to find an electronic ballast?

Ice cap makes a nice one, but the cost is pretty high! $150!

98 Volts x 1.6 Amps = 156.8 Watts.

I think that 98 Volts is the key number, I ruined mine by giving it 130 Volts. I don't know where you are finding ballasts, for me here in Canada I can't find a suitable ballast from a supplier who will ship up here. Frustrating.

150 watt Ballast

http://www.marinedepot.com/md_viewItem.asp?idproduct=IC3121
http://www.petstore.com/ps_ViewItem-idProduct-IC3121.html
http://www.hamiltontechnology.com/shop/?sh...&cat=6&
http://www.venturelighting.com/VLPS/stand_...50WBallast.html
http://www.1000bulbs.com/product.php?product=1348
http://cgi.ebay.com/150-watt-Universal-Met...1QQcmdZViewItem
http://cgi.ebay.com/150-Watt-Metal-Halide-...1QQcmdZViewItem

This one looks alright....

http://www.ballastwise.com/item.asp?PID=12...evel=0

Should I be looking for ANSI M107? If not what ANSI #?

Edit, Im a dork, thats a flourescent ballast!

Edit my edit: it says MH in one place and florescent in another. Very confusing.

Sorry If you've already mentioned this Elken but what is the CRI of the Powerball? I'll guess it's 90.

I'm just wondering because the CDM 400w Philips I bought is 85

Thanks for that! I just bought two M102 ballasts from that ebay link. I just hope the guy doesn't soak me on shipping rates.

Snow problem. I hate it when theres trouble shipping north. Anyone heard of NAFTA?

For any fellow US members looking to buy the now-famous CDM150/TD/942, I might suggest you stay away from BulbConnection.com. Full story here.

On a related note, does anyone know, from personal experience, of a place that sells UNBROKEN Philips ceramic MH bulbs? Thanks so much.

don't bother with the Philips CDM, get an OSRAM Powerball, it's the same.....just better

CDM 150W is 96, fron the Philips datasheet

Powerball 150W is 95 from the OSRAM commercial sheet, and >90 from their technical catalog

I dont know about this company, but they sell them.

http://www.donsbulbs.com/cgi-bin/r/b.pl/cd...42~philips.html

ahhh tonight ARKAY is coming over for a visit,, so not much posting,, we're gonna be conferring on many things and new designs,,, gonna be fun from now on,,, I have several new radical ideas,, almost time to build a real projector, and seal it for use only,,, hello new panel,,, hehehehheheh

oh and in answer about the new ball ceramic,, yep its even better,,

but dont put that good faithful philips one out to pasture at all,, she is good too,,,

Have you done the hqi test yet?

DJ

nag nag nag nag,, geez good thing you aint my wife hehehehehehhehe

Ohhhhh boy,, tonight we upscaled a dvd to HDef level,,,, oohhhh myyyy what a difference..

makes the original dvd played normally look like video tape,, heheh cpu runs hot too,, this was a hand taken shot,,, he has less DT's than me,, but still bit blurred,, oh well

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should have used a tripod to get the absolutely scarey sharpness the scene had...

What software are you using for upscaling?

I use FFDShow with LSF or SeeSaw and it really does turn an ordinary DVD into something special.

Was watching 'Flight 93' tonight and I'm sure I could have just stepped into that airplane cabin from my room, in my opinion it rivals 1080 in quality.

media portal with ffdshow

Well here's the EV numbers I got.

These are only for the 150 Watt bulb. I got distracted with my seventeen year old, I bought him a dirt bike and we had to go play.

About 1 foot away from the bulb I measured 12.0 EV = 10,240 lux

At the triplet on the screen side I measured 12.5 EV = 14,400 lux

At the screen which was about 5 feet away from PJ, screen size of about 4ft x 4ft approx. 4.0 EV = 40 lux

The PJ has no reflector or PreCon

I'll do the 400w this week sometime.

I use a 400W OSRAM HQI with a very good CRI (>90) but a strong peak in the green, and had the opportunity to calibrate my projector this week-end using a professional calibrator (gretag mac beth) borrowed from a friend.

The picture is absolutly stunning now. I see blues and reds i didn't suspect before. Flesh tones are good, gamma curve is now perfect ... I don't know if you're familiar with the sRGB gamut thing, but here are the results :
- this bulb make very good greens (it exceeds the sRGB gamut)
- the bulb is not able to make a real sRGB red (nearly but a little orange)
- the bulb is not able to make a real sRGB blue by quite a wide margin (the blue have a shift to the green)

BUT (there is a BUT ) ...

This came at a cost of 40% (yes 40% !) less lumens mainly because of all the green that had to be removed. My setup could output 170 ANSI lumens uncalibrated (with reflector + condenser), and is now down to 99 ANSI lumens . Also contrast ratio has gone done accordingly from 200:1 (at the triplet) to something in the 120:1 range.

So if I could have had a bulb with a perfect spectral distribution (RGB) and 40% less power, I would still have the same lumens output AND my original contrast ratio. A 240W of that kind would be exactly equivalent to my 400W HQI. You see the point ? Power is not eveything.

I believe this is why elken is having so good results with the powerballs and philips mastercolor. Those bulbs have a very good spectral distribution, and can output true red and true blue. Thus the LCD doesn't need a lots of RGB tweaking, then the contrast ratio is maintened, and all the luxies () are useful luxies ...

I more and more believe that :
- contrast is very important
- correct colors are very important
- correct gamma is crucial
- lumens are less important especially if a low vignetting can be achieved and if you have a good screen (like a dalite high power with 2.8 gain like the one i have)

Hi, elken.
Finally I think that I'll purchase a 150W kit for my projector (with a 17" screen too, except if I can found a 15.4" very cheap).
You have a condenser lens. What do you make, for that the condenser lens not cracked for the hot?

For the moment I have:
I have the pro lens kit.
I have the pro reflector.
I have a 74mm condenser (ELKEN: it's good?).

Thank you.

Hey guys,

Don't post over here much these day but thought I'd drop some info on what I saw at elken's place last night.

I have to admit that I was sceptical as well. Having been one of the first to use a 400w HQI way back when. I always thought it made more sense to blast as many lumens at an LCD as possible in the dim hope that you'd get a brighter image at the screen.

From what I've seen now that is just plain wrong.

The images we were watching on Elkens current rig last night far surpassed anything I've seen from ANY other DIY projector. It's hard to put into words but it most certainly is NOT about brightness.

The image we were viewing was crisp, sharp (corner to corner), bright but maintained all it's contrast. Shadow detail was there, colour balance was there, detail was there. Lighting was even.

We were talking about perceptual brightness. I spend a lot of time in front of a 50" plasma and am a tweak fanatic from a HTPC point of view (am a moderator on www.xpmediacenter.com.au). What I was seeing on the projector was not dissimilar to what I see on my plasma.

Ok. Brightness is obviously less on the PJ but you can't compare front projection to plasma anyway. The point is that in my mind I was seeing an image of equivalent depth and detail as I would expect to see on my plasma. It was sweet and still bright enough to give me the sensation of say a light in a dark scene being "blindingly" bright.

I've noticed over time that DIY PJ's tend to exhibit a lot of digital artifacting. The most common of which has been the "clay face" problem where you get a group of overbright pixels standing out (particularly on skin tones). My 400w HQI exhibited this badly and it's something that I am very sensitive to. The 150w just plainly and simply doesn't do it. I dunno whether it's the spectral distibution, the lesser wattage, the panel trasnmissiveness (is that even a word?"). The image was simply stunning and had real depth. The range of adjustment you could perform was more in line with my plasma than a PJ, it's not so sensitive to minor change requiring re-calibration for every source which is something that bugged me with the original 400W.

The image size we were viewing was 150cm's. Bigger than my plasma but not 10' wide either. I'm very interested to see it on a full size screen.

I can hear that people will be thinking "ah.. small screen. condensed image, no wonder it's so bright". but no. You'd be wrong. I would expect it to be every bit as viewable on a 110" screen. It's more about the balance of contrast/brightness than lux measurements. Of course it requires a light controlled room, but I've never seen a decent projection in any other sort of room, regardless of quoted lumen ratings. Pointing it at a high gain screen (2.8 Dalite) would result in an awesome image!!

I'm not a huge optical theorist. Know about as much as I want to about lenses, panels, lamps etc. The main thing for me is PQ and this PJ really has it.

I always had plans to build a new PJ but since buying the plasma they've gone by the wayside... After seeing this puppy my wife is going to hate me again... As soon I'll be making an addition to the HT room

Cheers,

Arkay.

Well, there goes the resale value of my 400W HQI.

Anyone want to be a 400W HQI. going cheap!

Elken2004,



I heard you were into light bulbs. I've got the brightest bulb in my briefcase for sale.



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PM me if you're interested.



MARVIN













JK Elken2004 It's just me again almost got you that time didn't I


BTW you're results so far are astounding and your work is a huge asset to us LLers!